Author Topic: protestant prayers are kaballistic black magic  (Read 4788 times)

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Offline pope daniel

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protestant prayers are kaballistic black magic
« on: November 30, 2011, 01:47:05 AM »
This is a scan of an actual rite of Transcendental Magic from 1896. It is no coincidence that the cult of Freemasonry summons "the Lord," chant "the Lord's Prayer" and chant to the Morning Star, Luciferian Biblical Jesus, just as they do in the Vatican II heretical Mass designed by, who other than Luciferian Freemasons.



full version here http://fatimamovement.com/images/010_Makingtheourfather/Lord%20of%20the%20Occult%202.jpg
« Last Edit: November 30, 2011, 02:05:42 AM by pope daniel »
Revelation 3:14 "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation.

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #1 on: November 30, 2011, 02:37:19 PM »
Bump...


Went to a Protestant Church last evening to watch my son play a recital for band.

In their 'worship center'  there is No Cross, No Crucifix, no reminders of Christ!
There is a picture however, of a Dove behind and above the stage that has a podium, with a band (Drums, keyboards etc) next to it...upper middle class white Baptist Church.

I looked through the hymms...lots of songs to 'The Lord'
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline OldTimes

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« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2011, 08:18:22 AM »
In their 'worship center'  there is No Cross, No Crucifix, no reminders of Christ!
There is a picture however, of a Dove behind and above the stage that has a podium, with a band (Drums, keyboards etc) next to it...upper middle class white Baptist Church.

I looked through the hymms...lots of songs to 'The Lord'

Definitely sounds suspicious, however is it possible that it's due to 'real Christians' not using any idolatry whatsoever?  Real Christians don't even wear crosses.

Offline FrankDialogue

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« Reply #3 on: December 05, 2011, 08:36:28 AM »
Bump...


Went to a Protestant Church last evening to watch my son play a recital for band.

In their 'worship center'  there is No Cross, No Crucifix, no reminders of Christ!
There is a picture however, of a Dove behind and above the stage that has a podium, with a band (Drums, keyboards etc) next to it...upper middle class white Baptist Church.

I looked through the hymms...lots of songs to 'The Lord'

Sure it wasn't a masonic temple?

By the way, I was listening to Alex Jones last week, and he state that he had a personal relationship with 'the G-d of the Universe'.  :)

Lot of the 'heartland Christians' also make reference to 'Yahweh God'.

But I don't castigate any denomination as long as they stick to the Gospel, the Father, Son & Holy Ghost, and pray in the name of Our Lord Jesus Christ, and follow His commandments.

Offline Sue

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« Reply #4 on: December 05, 2011, 09:11:51 AM »
Bump...

Went to a Protestant Church last evening to watch my son play a recital for band.

In their 'worship center'  there is No Cross, No Crucifix, no reminders of Christ!
There is a picture however, of a Dove behind and above the stage that has a podium, with a band (Drums, keyboards etc) next to it...upper middle class white Baptist Church.

I looked through the hymms...lots of songs to 'The Lord'


The Chancel of the City Church of St. Mary in Wittenberg

Lutheran Churches are definitely not as ornate as the Catholic Churches are, but they do have a simple cross as far as I can remember, inside and outside.

What is in your heart and mind, that is what counts.

 

"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline FrankDialogue

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« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2011, 07:13:22 AM »
What is in your heart and mind, that is what counts.


Absolutely.

The simple 'Lord's Prayer' ('Our Father') is the basic prayed for all Christians, and all people...It came from the lips of Jesus Himself.

If one is worried about 'kaballah' simply stick to the Lord's Prayer, or just pray from your heart...God hears.

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #6 on: February 03, 2012, 06:59:06 PM »
Catholic Douay Rhimes Bible. contains all 73 books, including the 7 Deutero-Canonical books (erroneously called Apocrypha by Protestants).
These 7 books were included in the 1611 KJV, but Not in later KJV Bibles.

1946 Dead-sea scrolls, prove 7 DC books were used by the Jews in Alexandria.

Interesting to note that the Palestinian Jews did Not accept the 7 DC books for their version of Scriptures nor New Testament.

Yet Protestants base their Bible on this version which comes from a people who did Not accept Christ as Messiah.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline laconas

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« Reply #7 on: February 03, 2012, 07:52:04 PM »
This is a scan of an actual rite of Transcendental Magic from 1896. It is no coincidence that the cult of Freemasonry summons "the Lord," chant "the Lord's Prayer" and chant to the Morning Star, Luciferian Biblical Jesus, just as they do in the Vatican II heretical Mass designed by, who other than Luciferian Freemasons.



full version here http://fatimamovement.com/images/010_Makingtheourfather/Lord%20of%20the%20Occult%202.jpg

I was in a home recently that had a Masonic Bible from 1928 on the bookshelf. I didn't have too much time to look at it, but it had a big illustration of Solomon's Temple in the first or 3rd page. The owner(she) of said bible is a Christian and had a Jewish maternal grandmother.

It's a strange feeling when you come across this stuff in the real world.

Nobody censors what they agree with

Offline Sue

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« Reply #8 on: February 03, 2012, 10:17:50 PM »
Bump...


Went to a Protestant Church last evening to watch my son play a recital for band.

In their 'worship center'  there is No Cross, No Crucifix, no reminders of Christ!
There is a picture however, of a Dove behind and above the stage that has a podium, with a band (Drums, keyboards etc) next to it...upper middle class white Baptist Church.

I looked through the hymms...lots of songs to 'The Lord'

We have three churches here: No Catholic, no Lutheran Church.

Evangelical Free Church
Jehovah's Witnesses Kingdom H…
New Life Outreach (Never heard of that one.)

Don't ask me what all they stand for, but I think they all like the chosen. When it gets a little warmer, I will step inside and see what they have.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2012, 01:27:18 PM by sushigirl »
"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline Spahi

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« Reply #9 on: February 03, 2012, 10:33:23 PM »
I was in a home recently that had a Masonic Bible from 1928 on the bookshelf. I didn't have too much time to look at it, but it had a big illustration of Solomon's Temple in the first or 3rd page. The owner(she) of said bible is a Christian and had a Jewish maternal grandmother.

It's a strange feeling when you come across this stuff in the real world.

No kidding. I see a few Freemason bumper stickers every now and then, and have seen a few of their temples but never their Bible.

Offline dean_saor

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« Reply #10 on: February 04, 2012, 02:08:02 AM »

Lutheran Churches are definitely not as ornate as the Catholic Churches are, but they do have a simple cross as far as I can remember, inside and outside.

What is in your heart and mind, that is what counts.


I grew up as a Scots Presbyterian. Although the church was largely unadorned with symbols, there was always a wooden cross on the altar table, and the ceremony was always firmly rooted in the NT and included the Lord's Prayer.

I believe that the Presbyterian Church in America is quite keen on the boycott and disinvest from Israel movement.

Did you know that Cromwell chased the Baptists out of Britain as being nutters?
Cha do dhùin doras nach d'fhosgail doras eile;
No door shut but another door opened

Offline FrankDialogue

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« Reply #11 on: February 04, 2012, 06:01:40 AM »



Did you know that Cromwell chased the Baptists out of Britain as being nutters?

Killed and robbed the Catholics, chased out the Baptists and brought the Jews back in...Britain was never the same thereafter...Set English brother against brother.

I read a wonderful essay recently (forget where), that traces the present day state of England, as a haven for the worst speculative capital, with a flood of immigrants to serve the speculators, directly from the time of Cromwell's perfidy...When I get a moment, I will dig it up and post it.
« Last Edit: February 04, 2012, 06:15:06 AM by FrankDialogue »

Offline dean_saor

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« Reply #12 on: February 04, 2012, 11:12:19 AM »
It's interesting that it is impossible (virtually) to get a complete transcript of King Charles I's statement at his show trial because he names all of Cromwell's financiers, which he calls "Dutch Bankers". But Cromwell wasn't able, despite his power, to get King Edward I's Banning Act 1260 repealed - so Jews are still illegally living in England, the 19th Century Jewish Emancipation Act notwithstanding.

But your source is probably correct in tracing the present situation to Cromwell. I wish those people who take to blaming "the British" or "the Crown" for all the iniquities of the world would have the courage to finger the real culprits.
Cha do dhùin doras nach d'fhosgail doras eile;
No door shut but another door opened

Offline Sue

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« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2012, 02:27:37 PM »

I grew up as a Scots Presbyterian. Although the church was largely unadorned with symbols, there was always a wooden cross on the altar table, and the ceremony was always firmly rooted in the NT and included the Lord's Prayer.

Our churches (other than the Catholic Church) were simple and down to Earth, much like yours was. Once in a I while I went along with my childhood friends. My parents were decent and good citizens, but no church people.

Quote
I believe that the Presbyterian Church in America is quite keen on the boycott and disinvest from Israel movement.

Interesting, and all power to them!

Quote
Did you know that Cromwell chased the Baptists out of Britain as being nutters?

No, I did not know that, Dean. Have you ever seen this:

"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline dean_saor

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« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2012, 02:36:20 PM »
No, I hadn't seen that (I've bookmarked it now though, thanks). John Myles of Ilston Church and most of his congregation fled to New England, and eventually founded Swansea, Massachusetts, in the later 1640s. I believe there is now a link between Swansea MA and Swansea West Glamorgan.
Cha do dhùin doras nach d'fhosgail doras eile;
No door shut but another door opened

Offline Sue

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« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2012, 02:36:46 PM »
It's interesting that it is impossible (virtually) to get a complete transcript of King Charles I's statement at his show trial because he names all of Cromwell's financiers, which he calls "Dutch Bankers". But Cromwell wasn't able, despite his power, to get King Edward I's Banning Act 1260 repealed - so Jews are still illegally living in England, the 19th Century Jewish Emancipation Act notwithstanding.

But your source is probably correct in tracing the present situation to Cromwell. I wish those people who take to blaming "the British" or "the Crown" for all the iniquities of the world would have the courage to finger the real culprits.

Titles of honour

What titles of honour did Oliver Cromwell create?
Does anyone still use the hereditary titles he created?

As Lord Protector, especially after his ‘reinvestiture’ under the revised written constitution of summer 1657, Cromwell held and exercised the power to bestow a range of titles of honour, some of them hereditary. At the Restoration of Charles II in spring 1660 all such titles lapsed as being without legal substance. However, through a mixture of generosity and expediency, Charles swiftly regranted many of these titles. A handful of regranted Cromwellian titles are still in use today.

Early in 1649, shortly after the execution of Charles I, the House of Lords was abolished – Cromwell did not play a significant role in this development and probably did not support this move – and it remained in abeyance until the Restoration, eleven years later. However, the long-established hereditary aristocracy was not abolished and existing hereditary titles were unaffected and continued not only to be used 1649-60 but also to be passed on from one generation to the next. During the 1650s, as before and since, upon the death of an existing earl, baron, viscount or whatever, the title passed to the deceased’s closest male heir.

more here
"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline Sue

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« Reply #16 on: February 04, 2012, 02:42:25 PM »
No, I hadn't seen that (I've bookmarked it now though, thanks). John Myles of Ilston Church and most of his congregation fled to New England, and eventually founded Swansea, Massachusetts, in the later 1640s.

I believe there is now a link between Swansea MA and Swansea West Glamorgan.

It sure looks that way, but then ~ why would it not? On our first trip to the US, years ago, the huge numbers of various churches just blew me away. I had never seen anything like it before. 
"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #17 on: February 04, 2012, 04:01:51 PM »
Its very ironic that so many from England fled Here to the USA, to escape religius persecution there, at the hands of Englands Protestant rulers.

Its a chapter not told or even heard for that matter.

"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline Sue

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« Reply #18 on: February 04, 2012, 06:28:58 PM »
Its very ironic that so many from England fled Here to the USA, to escape religius persecution there, at the hands of Englands Protestant rulers.

Its a chapter not told or even heard for that matter.

They were looking for religious freedom, I guess. I just came across this article, let me know what you think about it:

The use and abuse of “religion”



Joel Hodge ~ source

While one can only have deep sympathy for Christopher Hitchens as he fights cancer, the Lateline interview with him shows that Hitchens retains illogical views on religion. When asked about whether he thought religion would survive, Hitchens responded like this: “Religion is part of the human make-up. It's also part of our cultural and intellectual history”.

If religion is poisonous as Hitchens claims, then it seems that the “poison” will remain (despite its contribution to civilization, as he points out). But within Hitchens’s thinking, does this make sense?

In the background to Hitchens's view are two ways of seeing religion: as a naturally-occurring phenomenon; and as a socio-cultural construction. Because Hitchens says that religion is part of the human condition that won’t go away, he seems to believe that it is based in natural human capacities. If religion were merely a cultural construction, it could just as easily be deconstructed and wiped out.

Yet, if religion is naturally occurring and it “poisons” everything, the question remains: what is this religious capacity, naturally engrained in humans, that leads to “religious” evil? It seems that to pinpoint religion as “poisonous”, and to identify its origins in human nature, would lead one to think there is something defective about human beings themselves in their nature. This, then, actually leads us beyond the category of “religion” to contemplate human nature.

This argument is further supported by recent studies into the meaning of “religion”. In his exhaustive study, Professor William Cavanaugh argues that category of religion itself is problematic and politically-motivated. Hitchens (and most moderns) talk as if there is some absolute, free-standing category of “religion” that has a trans-historical and trans-cultural essence. Yet, there is no fool-proof way to define “religion” that will include such belief systems as Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Buddhism, Hinduism and Confucianism while excluding nationalism, political ideologies, capitalism, pop culture, sport and more.

Why is this so? Because, as Cavanaugh (and others) shows, religion is a construct of 16th and 17th century Europe. The meaning of the term “religion” dramatically changed in this time to justify the rise of the nation-state and a “secular” space that could exclude “religion” (essentially targeting Christian churches). The so-called “wars of religion” have been a crucial part of the justifying myth of the “secular” state, which supposedly saved Europe from religious violence. A closer analysis of these wars sees a complex array of alliances across “religious” divisions motivated by the rise of centralized state authorities. In other words, religion was a political category used to marginalize and label certain groups as other people centralized their “secular” power; and it has continued to be used in this way. Cavanaugh sums it up in this way:

    “But as Jonathan Z Smith [renown scholar of religion] points out, the lesson is not that religion cannot be defined, but that it can be defined more than fifty different ways. There is no trans-historical and trans-cultural essence of religion, but at different times and places, and for different purposes, some things have been constructed as religion and some things have not. For Western scholars in the nineteenth century, Confucianism was a religion. For Chinese nationalists, it emphatically was not. Instead of searching - in either a substantivist or functionalist mode - for the timeless, trans-cultural essence of religion, therefore, let us ask why certain things are called religion under certain conditions. What configurations of power are authorised by changes in the way the concept of religion - and its counterpart, the secular - are used? What changes in practices correspond to changes in these concepts? Why deny that the natives have religion at first, then assign some of their practices to the category religion? Which practices become religion, and why? Why deny that Marxism is a religion? Why accept that Marxism is a religion but emphatically deny that US nationalism is?”

    (W. Cavanaugh, The Myth of Religious Violence, [New York: Oxford University Press, 2009], p. 119).

Let me demonstrate one part of Cavanaugh’s argument. Religion is often identified with groups of people who hold common beliefs, undertake common activities and rituals, and have common scriptures, shrines or relics. Yet, this definition cannot be confined to what we ordinarily label religion as opposed to, for example, culture or nationalism. For example, American nationalism is often defined as a civic religion:

    “Will Herberg ... claimed, ‘By every realistic criterion, the American Way of Life is the operative religion of the American people.’ ...Carlton Hayes had identified the American religion’s saints (the founding fathers), its shrines (Independence Hall), its relics (the Liberty Bell), its holy scriptures (the Declaration of Independence, the Constitution), its martyrs (Lincoln), its inquisition (school boards that enforce patriotism), its Christmas (the Fourth of July), and its feast of Corpus Christi (Flag Day).”
   
(W. Cavanaugh, The Myth of Religious Violence, [New York: Oxford University Press, 2009], p. 116-7).

Like “religions”, nationalisms give us a sense of who we are as a community by defining ourselves in particular ways. In the Australian context, we saw this on display in the recent commemoration of the Sydney Olympics in which we remembered our saints (the gold medallists and volunteers), shrines (stadiums and tracks), relics (uniforms and medals), and, scriptures, songs and liturgies (the Opening Ceremony, victorious races and medal ceremonies). Thus, religion is not an absolute category, but can be used fluidly to point out ways in which humans beings build certain types of community.

Thus, if religion is a fluid category (that can encompass “secular” groups) - yet as Hitchens claims “religion” supposedly manifests a poisonous side to human beings - why not examine human nature (and human group dynamics) more closely, rather than just blame certain groupings of people we label “religious” for everything? This is a question that remains unanswered in the work of Hitchens and others, like Dawkins. Why? Because it would require a serious anthropological investigation of human beings; which itself would require them to give up some of their own dualistic beliefs. Hitchens and Dawkins each have their expertise and talents, but they are show amateurishness when it comes to mounting serious, academic arguments about religion and human nature.

This is not to say that one cannot argue for some naturally transcendent capacity of the human being, or that Christians or Muslims or others cause violence. It is clear that Christians and Muslims commit violent acts, but so do Americans and Australians, fathers and mothers, sporting clubs and gangs, and many other sorts of people.

What I am pointing out is how the category of religion has been and continues to be used and abused. Hitchens continues the lazy and politically-motivated terminology by claiming religion “poisons”, while not digging deeper. This leaves other people and institutions off the hook.

Hitchens is right to point out, though, that religion will continue to exist. It will remain while the liberal, secular discourse continues to label religion as “other” and “enemy”, which establishes a dualism to justify itself.

Joel Hodge is a lecturer in the Faculty of Theology and Philosophy at the Australian Catholic University's St Patrick’s campus, Melbourne.
"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #19 on: February 05, 2012, 04:38:59 AM »
Like “religions”, nationalisms give us a sense of who we are as a community by defining ourselves in particular ways. In the Australian context, we saw this on display in the recent commemoration of the Sydney Olympics in which we remembered our saints (the gold medallists and volunteers), shrines (stadiums and tracks), relics (uniforms and medals), and, scriptures, songs and liturgies (the Opening Ceremony, victorious races and medal ceremonies).
Thus, religion is not an absolute category, but can be used fluidly to point out ways in which humans beings build certain types of community.
(Good analogys, shouldve hit the point home harder though)

Thus, if religion is a fluid category (that can encompass “secular” groups) - yet as Hitchens claims “religion” supposedly manifests a poisonous side to human beings - why not examine human nature (and human group dynamics) more closely, rather than just blame certain groupings of people we label “religious” for everything?( This is a question that remains unanswered in the work of Hitchens and others, like Dawkins. Why? Because it would require a serious anthropological investigation of human beings; which itself would require them to give up some of their own dualistic beliefs. Hitchens and Dawkins each have their expertise and talents, but they are show amateurishness when it comes to mounting serious, academic arguments about religion and human nature.
Agreed

This is not to say that one cannot argue for some naturally transcendent capacity of the human being, or that Christians or Muslims or others cause violence. It is clear that Christians and Muslims commit violent acts, but so do Americans and Australians, fathers and mothers, sporting clubs and gangs, and many other sorts of people.
Good points

What I am pointing out is how the category of religion has been and continues to be used and abused. Hitchens continues the lazy and politically-motivated terminology by claiming religion “poisons”, while not digging deeper. This leaves other people and institutions off the hook.

Hitchens is right to point out, though, that religion will continue to exist. It will remain while the liberal, secular  (JEW) discourse continues to label religion as “other” and “enemy”, which establishes a dualism to justify itself."



Well said and pointed out, though he couldve gone much further in excoriating those like Hitchens on their modern day Witch hunts parroting  & Promoting the (Jew ) argument for destruction of Fiath via the Protocols #14
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress