Author Topic: The Traditional Latin Mass  (Read 4210 times)

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Offline irmatvep

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« Reply #40 on: August 25, 2011, 09:39:37 AM »
Amen Frank.  As long as God is truly glorified from the heart it really doesn't matter which Mass one attends.  Both are equally valid.  I know I'll catch all kinds of flack from Walt about my comment.

I know this is going to date me but I remember as a kid (before V2 when the Mass was exclusively Tridentine), attending Mass and having absolutely no idea of what was taking place.  I was all Greek to me.  Boy in those days the priests were really tough too.  The Monsignor was an old Irish guy who really put the fear of God into you.  One slip up and it was hell and damnation for all eternity.  All the kids in the parish were afraid of him and would run away every time we saw him coming.  As a result of this mentality, which was common in those days, my only childhood memory of God was that He was this big ogre.  I was literally terrified of God.  Priests like the old Monsignor were counterproductive.   To this day whenever this subject comes up with my brother I sense a great deal of anger in him because of this priest.

Younger people like Walt have no memory of all the abuses that occurred prior to V2 and have a distorted view and tend to think every thing was rosy in the Church.  Well is wasn't. 

I also agree that the TLM is in many ways far superior and more reverant.  I personally am more drawn to it.




Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #41 on: August 25, 2011, 04:08:57 PM »
Amen Frank.  As long as God is truly glorified from the heart it really doesn't matter which Mass one attends.  Both are equally valid.  I know I'll catch all kinds of flack from Walt about my comment.

I know this is going to date me but I remember as a kid (before V2 when the Mass was exclusively Tridentine), attending Mass and having absolutely no idea of what was taking place.  I was all Greek to me.  Boy in those days the priests were really tough too.  The Monsignor was an old Irish guy who really put the fear of God into you.  One slip up and it was hell and damnation for all eternity.  All the kids in the parish were afraid of him and would run away every time we saw him coming.  As a result of this mentality, which was common in those days, my only childhood memory of God was that He was this big ogre.  I was literally terrified of God.  Priests like the old Monsignor were counterproductive.   To this day whenever this subject comes up with my brother I sense a great deal of anger in him because of this priest.

Younger people like Walt have no memory of all the abuses that occurred prior to V2 and have a distorted view and tend to think every thing was rosy in the Church.  Well is wasn't. 

I also agree that the TLM is in many ways far superior and more reverant.  I personally am more drawn to it.

Im 42, I grew up WITH Vatican 2 guitar masses.

My dad was an altar boy and remembered with fondness the Latin Mass, that was my only connection to the Latin Mass.

It wasnt until about 10 years ago I found the Latin Mass.

I tried SPPX, SPPV, Independent and Maronite-Byzantine. 
And spent years deliberating and studying The Mass, Canon Law, Jewry, Church tradition and history.

Things were not perfect pre Vatican 2, but it wasnt apostasy, blasphemy  and a free for all, either. 
I will take rigid structure, over chaos and widespread abuse, any day.

Needless to say, my children attend and will be raised in and attend Latin Mass until they die. And so will their children.


"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #42 on: August 25, 2011, 05:26:31 PM »
Clefty...get lost Bozo.
ha ha ha...you wish...

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No one is typing to you and your Judaic nonsense anymore, least of all me.

we'll see...

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Not only invalid, but a sacrilidge.
Do you not understand.....Vatican 2 Jews and Freemasons CHANGED Christ's Own Words.
The CANON of the Mass, was changed.

um..yup your church made many changes and made official some other changes made before you were incorporated...and now some of these changes you dont agree with...

but I agree with you... changes make things invalid...a sacrilidge...certainly not the same


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The Tridentine Mass was Extinct were it not for the SPPX and Trads.

The Pauline Sacrilidge revolutionized and radicalized a new worship, more akin to Protestant ecumenical service.  Not to mention that illicit invalid nature, given that the Canon was Changed.

It was not just an altering, it was a total Overhaul of 1600 years of reverent Orthodoxy and Worship.
This is what you cannot grasp.  It was by design, 'Change the Mass, Change the Faith' and they did.

wow...INDEED..."change the faith"...it certainly changes the allegiances...God v. traditions of man?

so lets review the changes your tradition made from the original

it was an ANNUAL (meaning once a year not weekly) OLD TESTAMENT (which you claim is aboished)  festival that Jesus was celebrating and revalidating using unleavened bread and grape juice..

He never instructed that it be changed to a weekly sunday ritual of only bread and juice "THIS DO" includes the whole yearly feast...

He never changed it to a sunday morning snack... HELLO? it's a last SUPPER....

and oh, it was not the passover as lamb wasnt even on the menu...

the unleavened bread and the grape juice (yes grape juice NOT wine as wine is fermented/leavened) was instructed to "be divided" among ALL the disciples even one with a devil...the tradition keeps that the bread was handled and broken by each serving himself and the juice was drunk with each serving himself...not "on the tongue" while kneeling...

in your history the laity have not recieved both species and some are even refused...not because the have "the devil" but MEDICAL reasons...

"Haley’s Communion controversy isn’t the first. In 2001, the family of a 5-year-old Massachusetts girl with the disease left the Catholic church after being denied permission to use a rice wafer." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5762478/ns/health-allergies_and_asthma/t/girl-digestive-disease-denied-communion/

leftover bread in the OT passover is RE-USED not burned as if sacred...

water was NOT added to the juice...

what WAS added to the OLD TESTAMENT ordinance was  the NEW TESTAMENT ritual of the foot washing...does that happen every time unleavened bread is eaten or just once a year?..."If I do not wash you, you have no part with me..."

so you do that ONCE a year but eat the unleavened bread every sunday?

in fact the only thing you have NOT changed is the unleavened bread...
ok you shape it into a sun disc but maybe THAT was how the bread was made...

you pick and choose...

if Jesus didnt make any changes to His Law or traditions...why should man?




But here you are willing to "damn" a fellow catholic for accepting later changes...of course changes made later than the changes you accept...

"Not everyone who says to Me, Lord, Lord, shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven"...

what is His will? Keep the commandments...He dont like changes either..once killed a man who touched the cart carrying the Law to steady it...dude was afraid it was falling...he thought he was preserving the law...but he was told not to touch it...

harsh...but changes make things confusing dont you think? makes things corrupted no?

glad we agree....
« Last Edit: August 25, 2011, 05:51:19 PM by clefty »

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #43 on: August 25, 2011, 05:50:52 PM »
Clefty,

Yours is another Hijack, and Ive no interest in countering Judaic nonsense.
Go fishing elsewhere or start another thread.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #44 on: August 25, 2011, 07:18:09 PM »
Clefty,

Yours is another Hijack,
Hijack? ha ha ha...Actually its not Walt because I am talking about the topic of the thread which includes changes to the eucharist.

And I am ironically agreeing with you...

Quote
and Ive no interest in countering Judaic nonsense.
Just because its the original law and tradition of the OLD TESTAMENT and revalidated by Jesus doesnt make it nonsense...

Quote
Go fishing elsewhere or start another thread.

How about you explain the change from grape juice to wine...

or at least admit V2 wasnt the only corruption from the mass...certianly from the original ekklessia



"Our Lord Jesus Christ had used “fruit of the vine” during the Lord’s Supper.  In our modern language “fruit of the vine” is grape juice.  In the original Greek text “fruit of the vine” is “gennema ampelos” [ gennhmatoV thV ampelou ].  The other gospel writer Mark had also written “fruit of the vine”.  It must be pointed out that both Gospel writers were very clear about what they had written.  They had both used the term “oinos” which is the Greek word for “wine” in other texts but they clearly wrote “gennema ampelos” in describing one of the elements used in the Lord’s Supper.  Why did our Lord Jesus Christ use “fruit of the vine” (grape juice) and not “wine” for the Holy Communion?  Here are the reasons:

 

It was during the Feast of the Unleavened Bread and the Passover that our Lord Jesus Christ had instituted the Holy Communion.  God had given this commandment to Moses:  “Seven days you shall eat unleavened bread.  On the first day you shall remove leaven from your houses.  For whoever eats from the first day until the seventh day, that person shall be cut off from Israel.” (Ex. 12:15; 18-20).  Why is leaven forbidden during the Passover?  The Passover prefigured the supreme sacrifice of our Lord Jesus Christ whose body was sinless (1 Cor. 5:7-8; 2 Cor. 5:21).  Leaven represented corruption and therefore symbolized evil (Mt. 16:6,12; Gal. 5:9)

 

As the unleavened bread represents the sinless body of Christ, so the “fruit of the vine” (pure grape juice) represents the perfect, pure and sinless blood of Christ (Mt. 26:28-29).  It is also called the blood of God (Acts 20:28).  Wine that is fermented cannot represent the pure blood of the Lord Jesus Christ.  Fermentation produces a chemical change that increases the alcoholic content of the substance that causes intoxication.  "

http://sites.google.com/site/wineorgrapejuiceholycommunion/

See Walt? I agree with you....

Change is corruption. Right Walt?

A leavening. Something the scriptures warn us against. Right Walt?

Walt?







Offline pope daniel

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« Reply #45 on: August 25, 2011, 07:43:52 PM »
  No wonder the movement isn't bearing much fruit. 

<-------------  ;)
Revelation 3:14 "To the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God's creation.

Offline Iron Webmaster

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« Reply #46 on: August 29, 2011, 09:51:56 AM »
And then there is the real mass, an annual Passover dinner where everyone gets drunk. There are not even particular words to be said as no words are ordained as required. It does not say, Repeat after me.

NOTHING else is ordained by Jesus. No modifications or additions are authorized. Anything else is pure invention having no connection with the gospels.
1.9 GB of pure vanity

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back.
That is all you need to know about the conflict. All the rest is distraction.
See the new biopic, Jesus Christ: Lust for Glory!

Offline AngelOfLight

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« Reply #47 on: August 29, 2011, 11:04:30 AM »
And then there is the real mass, an annual Passover dinner where everyone gets drunk. There are not even particular words to be said as no words are ordained as required. It does not say, Repeat after me.

NOTHING else is ordained by Jesus. No modifications or additions are authorized. Anything else is pure invention having no connection with the gospels.


Such intellectual and factual comment is worth quoting!


lol ;D
Judge me if you're with out sin!

Offline Iron Webmaster

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« Reply #48 on: August 29, 2011, 12:49:26 PM »

Such intellectual and factual comment is worth quoting!

lol ;D

A complex ritual invented out of whole cloth and contrary to its purported source and they argue over which language to use. It is "pay the two dollars" kind of humor.

The only framework in which it makes any kind of sense at all is magic.

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Libre incende!
Don't speak Latin in front of the book, Xander.
1.9 GB of pure vanity

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back.
That is all you need to know about the conflict. All the rest is distraction.
See the new biopic, Jesus Christ: Lust for Glory!

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #49 on: August 29, 2011, 01:16:06 PM »
A complex ritual invented out of whole cloth and contrary to its purported source and they argue over which language to use. It is "pay the two dollars" kind of humor.

The only framework in which it makes any kind of sense at all is magic.

===
Libre incende!
Don't speak Latin in front of the book, Xander.

Latin is a Dead Language, and therefore incorruptible.

There is no argument about what language, Latin has been said for over 1700 years.

Jew and Masonic apostates tried to usurp with innovations and inventions in the vernacular.
It has run its course and is being steered back to the fountain.

The rest of your post is Jew nonsense.

"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline Iron Webmaster

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« Reply #50 on: August 29, 2011, 02:13:25 PM »
Latin is a Dead Language, and therefore incorruptible.

The exact wording of spells is important else they will not work or worse cause a consequence harmful to the spell caster. It is a common mistake when conjuring the devil. For other risks I direct your attention to the Latin lesson in The Life of Brian.

Quote
There is no argument about what language, Latin has been said for over 1700 years.

Actually it began after Rome broke away from the central authority in Constantinople. Then the Greek mass was "translated" into vernaclar Latin. Of course it is third century AD vulgar Latin instead of classical Latin so its meaning was already corrupted when the translation was made. In any event, a Latin mass is a vernacular mass. You have to use Greek to avoid a vernacular mass.

It should be trivial for you to research the first mention of a ceremony which would be identifiable as a mass. You are invited to keep in mind the NT is as silent on priests as it is on other than communal meals with lots of drinking. There are only bishops, deacons and presbyters. It is reasonable to ask what is a mass without a priest. But lets read the earliest reference to an identifiable mass first. Be certain the URL you post does in fact contain identifiable features.

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Jew and Masonic apostates tried to usurp with innovations and inventions in the vernacular.
It has run its course and is being steered back to the fountain.

Rather more important is words no longer have the same connotation they once did even if in Latin. Living water is an obvious one. Living simply meant moving but in those days moving carried the connotation of being alive. The term living water was meant literally.

Speaking of ideas, the transubstantiation was invented in the 8th c. right? Or was a later?

There is also no question the first Christians expected the return of Jesus in their lifetime. Therefore the first Christians got it all wrong. They were sold a bill of goods. The religion was started on false pretenses. It was bait and switch. Rational people would denounce the fraud for the fraud it was.

Quote
The rest of your post is Jew nonsense.

Quote
As I wrote
Quote
And then there is the real mass, an annual Passover dinner where everyone gets drunk. There are not even particular words to be said as no words are ordained as required. It does not say, Repeat after me.

NOTHING else is ordained by Jesus. No modifications or additions are authorized. Anything else is pure invention having no connection with the gospels.

... and ...

A complex ritual invented out of whole cloth and contrary to its purported source and they argue over which language to use. It is "pay the two dollars" kind of humor.

The only framework in which it makes any kind of sense at all is magic.

Those are FACTS which you have not addressed in the least. They are not "jewish" they are observations from the plain reading of the words.

Regardless of the language there is ZERO biblical basis for your magical mass. None whatsoever. You had the opportunity to present a basis for it but you did not. You chose rather to say irrelevant things with no bearing on the subject.

Can you not do better than that?
1.9 GB of pure vanity

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back.
That is all you need to know about the conflict. All the rest is distraction.
See the new biopic, Jesus Christ: Lust for Glory!

Offline Father Brown

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« Reply #51 on: August 29, 2011, 03:12:36 PM »
Amen Frank.  As long as God is truly glorified from the heart it really doesn't matter which Mass one attends.  Both are equally valid.  I know I'll catch all kinds of flack from Walt about my comment.

I know this is going to date me but I remember as a kid (before V2 when the Mass was exclusively Tridentine), attending Mass and having absolutely no idea of what was taking place.  I was all Greek to me.  Boy in those days the priests were really tough too.  The Monsignor was an old Irish guy who really put the fear of God into you.  One slip up and it was hell and damnation for all eternity.  All the kids in the parish were afraid of him and would run away every time we saw him coming.  As a result of this mentality, which was common in those days, my only childhood memory of God was that He was this big ogre.  I was literally terrified of God.  Priests like the old Monsignor were counterproductive.   To this day whenever this subject comes up with my brother I sense a great deal of anger in him because of this priest.

Younger people like Walt have no memory of all the abuses that occurred prior to V2 and have a distorted view and tend to think every thing was rosy in the Church.  Well is wasn't. 

I also agree that the TLM is in many ways far superior and more reverant.  I personally am more drawn to it.

The only Greek in the TLM is "Kyrie Elieson, Christe Elieson, Kyrie Elieson.

What was wrong with you people? Couldn't you afford a Missal? I have spoken to other older people who said they couldn't understand a word. But it all boils down to formation. I say anyone can attend that Mass without a Missal and know exactly what is going on. But apparently, the majority at the time, did not agree.

I've got a nice little book written by Vilma Little a lady from England. It is a Liturgical Latin book in order to learn the language. She said that people had been clamoring for an English Mass there for 100 years. This book was wrritten in 1943. So this fight had been going on for quite awhile. She predicted in the introduction that if Latin, the language of the Church goes, the Church will go and Europe will end up in a state worse than paganism before Christianity came to it. How right she was! She also wrote a nice little volume on understanding the Breviary for the layman.   

I've also seen a video which talked about a Liturgical Movement that begun in the '30s to get people to start bringing their Missals to Mass, etc. You've probably seen it. What was up with that? My best intuition on the subject tells me that people were going through the motions and here in America we had many poor immigrants who could not read English. That is understandable. But then why not in their own language? Answer, many off the boat could not even read their own language as they did not have the benefits of an education. My paternal grandparents being of that set.

It's a shame they did not wait it out. As most of us made it to some form of the Middle Class, and became more educated, the mystery of the TLM really opens up the Faith to those who spend the time on the Missal, the Breviary, etc. But, I still say the most simple people can understand it. And that is not a stretch at all. It was the Mass for the better part of 1800 years.   

And I'm just joking around in a friendly way with you, I am not trying to be flip or disrespecful.

Offline AngelOfLight

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« Reply #52 on: August 29, 2011, 03:15:17 PM »
A complex ritual invented out of whole cloth and contrary to its purported source and they argue over which language to use. It is "pay the two dollars" kind of humor.

The only framework in which it makes any kind of sense at all is magic.

===
Libre incende!
Don't speak Latin in front of the book, Xander.

To people like you there is no room for the slightest discussion, hence the statements you make!
You talk as if your theory is prof but I bet you can't describe the next creature to be discovered in the next days in the oceans or rain forests, some how you have solved the mysteries of the universe!

Thank GOD I consider my self humble and not all knowing!
Judge me if you're with out sin!

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #53 on: August 29, 2011, 03:17:42 PM »
The exact wording of spells is important else they will not work or worse cause a consequence harmful to the spell caster. It is a common mistake when conjuring the devil. For other risks I direct your attention to the Latin lesson in The Life of Brian.

Ive no interest in Atheist-Jew Monty Python BS. 
Thanks but no thanks..

Its well known that Occultist Jews say the Latin Tridentine Mass Backwards in their Rituals.



Quote
Actually it began after Rome broke away from the central authority in Constantinople. Then the Greek mass was "translated" into vernaclar Latin. Of course it is third century AD vulgar Latin instead of classical Latin so its meaning was already corrupted when the translation was made. In any event, a Latin mass is a vernacular mass. You have to use Greek to avoid a vernacular mass.

Greek was spoken By Christ and his disciples.
Greek supplanted Latin even in Rome. It still has a place in the Church, as does Aramaic and Latin.  It was approved by the Church for the Slav nations in the 9th century.
Greek continued in Greece, Turkey and Syria and was far older than Latin.
The Kyrie and Gloria of the Latin Mass, is said IN GREEK, and is STILL used IN the Latin Mass.

But as Latin is a Dead Language, it IS incorruptible and used as a basis for almost all European languages,  as it forbids all living languages due to corruption...and was preferred by Rome, once Constantinople fell into schism, it is a symbol of bond and unity for all Catholics throughout the world.


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It should be trivial for you to research the first mention of a ceremony which would be identifiable as a mass.

The Last Supper.
Next.


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Rather more important is words no longer have the same connotation they once did even if in Latin.
Sure they do, to Christians and Occultists.
Valid Form is necessary.



Quote
Speaking of ideas, the transubstantiation was invented in the 8th c. right? Or was a later?
The Christian Faith has evolved, and took time to affirm its dogmas. No internet, literacy, Fax, PC tends to slow down progress.

To your point:
A letter by Saint Ignatius of Antioch to the Romans, written in AD 106 says: "I desire the bread of GOD, which is the flesh of Jesus Christ."

150, Justin Martyr wrote of the Eucharist:
"Not as common bread and common drink do we receive these; but in like manner as Jesus Christ our Savior, having been made flesh by the Word of God, had both flesh and blood for our salvation, so likewise have we been taught that the food which is blessed by the prayer of His word, and from which our blood and flesh by transmutation are nourished, is the flesh and blood of that Jesus who was made flesh.'





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There is also no question the first Christians expected the return of Jesus in their lifetime. Therefore the first Christians got it all wrong. They were sold a bill of goods.
No one knows when Christ will return. That is made abundantly clear by HIM.


Quote
The religion was started on false pretenses. It was bait and switch. Rational people would denounce the fraud for the fraud it was.
Typical Protocol of Zion #14 Jew BS


Quote
Those are FACTS which you have not addressed in the least. They are not "jewish" they are observations from the plain reading of the words.
Your agenda, a Jew agenda, is abundantly clear.



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Regardless of the language there is ZERO biblical basis for your magical mass. None whatsoever. You had the opportunity to present a basis for it but you did not. You chose rather to say irrelevant things with no bearing on the subject.
Typical Zio Bullsht


Quote
Can you not do better than that?

I think I did just fine.  I call Jews out as well as anyone.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline AngelOfLight

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« Reply #54 on: August 29, 2011, 03:19:06 PM »
Latin is a Dead Language, and therefore incorruptible.

There is no argument about what language, Latin has been said for over 1700 years.

Jew and Masonic apostates tried to usurp with innovations and inventions in the vernacular.
It has run its course and is being steered back to the fountain.

The rest of your post is Jew nonsense.


You have ancient and liturgical Latin!
Judge me if you're with out sin!

Offline Father Brown

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« Reply #55 on: August 29, 2011, 03:22:05 PM »
And then there is the real mass, an annual Passover dinner where everyone gets drunk. There are not even particular words to be said as no words are ordained as required. It does not say, Repeat after me.

NOTHING else is ordained by Jesus. No modifications or additions are authorized. Anything else is pure invention having no connection with the gospels.

There was no repeat after me in the TLM. The prayers said in response were mostly done by the Altar Boys on behalf of the Laity. Of course, at High Mass, some responses are said by the people. But very few.

The Canon of the Mass is the most ancient and has barely been touched for a good 1800 years, perhaps longer. And the priest is talking to God. Not you or me or anyone else that may be sitting in the pews. It is the silent and most reverent part where the Consecration takes place. And it's not magic.

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #56 on: August 29, 2011, 03:24:16 PM »

You have ancient and liturgical Latin!

There are two real categories of difference, one having to do with pronunciation (idioms/words), another with style, in Ecclesiastical Vs Classical Latin (Spoken by Aristocracy and elite).


Ecclesiastical Latin (or medieval Latin) is the Latin language as it was developed in the early medieval period and utilized by the Catholic Church.

500 and 700AD; it was definitely the standard form of the language by Carolingian times.

'This Latin grew out of the so-called "Late Latin" (Latinitas Serior)  which was in use from the 3rd to the 6th centuries AD.

This ecclesiastical Latin was the language of Anselm, Alcuin and Aquinas, the Latin that was taught int he medieval universities and used at Lateran IV and Trent and which subsequently remained the language of the Church up until the upheaval of the Conciliar period, the sacra lingua of the Roman rite.'

"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline Iron Webmaster

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« Reply #57 on: August 29, 2011, 04:15:02 PM »
The only Greek in the TLM is "Kyrie Elieson, Christe Elieson, Kyrie Elieson.

What was wrong with you people? Couldn't you afford a Missal?

Why bother? For all the meaning it has it might as well be in Klingon. Without knowing the meaning of the words the words are indistinguishable from gibberish.

As the words themselves not the meanings are what is important to you folks that means it is to you indistinguishable from magic.
1.9 GB of pure vanity

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back.
That is all you need to know about the conflict. All the rest is distraction.
See the new biopic, Jesus Christ: Lust for Glory!

Offline Iron Webmaster

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- The Traditional Latin Mass
« Reply #58 on: August 29, 2011, 04:24:08 PM »
To people like you there is no room for the slightest discussion, hence the statements you make!
You talk as if your theory is prof but I bet you can't describe the next creature to be discovered in the next days in the oceans or rain forests, some how you have solved the mysteries of the universe!

A theory is an explanation of facts. I have not recited any theory. I have recited facts. You are free to quote any of the gospels regarding the last supper to show I am in error. Please feel free to do so. I merely read the recountings and compare them to the mass and observe there is no connection save in baseless claims of a connection. In that you are also invited to show a connection if you can find one.

Doing such an obvious thing is hardly in the category of solving the mysteries of the universe although I dare say it is hardly as mysterious to me as it is to you.

Quote
Thank GOD I consider my self humble and not all knowing!

There is no virtue in humility. In the proper meaning of the word it is to have a correct assessment of yourself however great you might be. Behaving otherwise is called false humility.
1.9 GB of pure vanity

Jews stole the land. The owners want it back.
That is all you need to know about the conflict. All the rest is distraction.
See the new biopic, Jesus Christ: Lust for Glory!

Offline Father Brown

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- The Traditional Latin Mass
« Reply #59 on: August 29, 2011, 04:27:23 PM »
Why bother? For all the meaning it has it might as well be in Klingon. Without knowing the meaning of the words the words are indistinguishable from gibberish.

As the words themselves not the meanings are what is important to you folks that means it is to you indistinguishable from magic.

I do know what the words mean. As Walt pointed out, the Latin, Greek and Hebrew that exists in the TLM is incorruptible. That means they cannot be changed by new shades of meaning due to slang, or natural evolution in language.

And I beg to differ with you that the words, and not the meaning, are what is important to us. Based on what I have read on these threads, you wouldn't understand. A well-formed Catholic understands things on the level of the soul. And these are mysteries and are not easily explained. You either live the Faith and let it wash over you, or you don't. Most, Catholics included, don't. And that is a sad state of affairs.

But, I do noitice that you are using words. Are you practicing magic? Maybe from your worldview you are. Language, thought, feeling, and understanding are only available to human creatures in this temporal world. I call it a miracle. You may well call it magic. The fact that my fingers can type black marks on a white screen and transmit my ideas, the lame and profound, as well as the sacred and profane is even a bigger miracle.