Author Topic: The Law - Sovereigns, time to stand up! Reclaim your rights  (Read 5945 times)

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Offline WaltDisney

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- The Law - Sovereigns, time to stand up! Reclaim your rights
« Reply #40 on: August 26, 2011, 06:07:24 PM »
Yes thank you for this Walt.  Even though you and I have had our differences in the past both our hearts are in the same place.  You are a damn good apologist. 

Basically it all boils down to a matter of faith, either you have it or you don't.

And thanks to both of you for reading and your kind words.

We do agree on matters of Faith.


But I will suggest to you that you take in a Latin Mass. Try it and see for yourself.

Dont take my word, please dont do that. 

Just Go, firsthand and spectate. 
Be an observer, but get a translated missal, so you can follow along.

Go a few times, than try your Novus Mass and see how they compare.


"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #41 on: August 27, 2011, 05:58:16 PM »
Only a sick Apostaet Jew can write such garbage.
Most of the world was illiterate.
There was no printing press, no widespread reading of the Bible, or no bible itself for 400 years and those were in small number.
and yet every one of the authors of the new testament were literate and wrote the gospel accounts PRIOR to the destruction of the temple...
as were the letters to the various churches in the region for the members to read...along with the old testemant which they also read...
all this literature became the new testament...
there was even much written which was NOT included....

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The CHURCH was the Christian body of believers, United and Universal.
of which the ROMAN church came later and claimed monopoly...as for United and universal? ha ha ha....
there was the jerusalem church,  antioch, John describes seven distinct churches...rome never came up
coptic churches and orthodox churches and miriam and...on and on it goes....
so did the bickering and quarreling...they were anything but UNITED
James asked why the war and fights came about within even the first century...and all these believers were warned of coming anti christs and perversians and corruptions...
circumscision and jesus resurrected were the main issues in the NT...
throughout which sabbath was kept...and yes the OT sunday first fruits and sunday pentecost

yes through out the New Testament the sabbath was kept as it all occured prior the destruction of Joorusalem's temple...
in fact Jooish accounts (see MORE writings) spoke of ALL animal sacrifices coming to an end between 34 and 69 ad
but the sabbath remained just a Jesus instructed

And as for UNITY
even the blessed eucharist of Jesus couldnt UNITE the minds of the disciples...one went to betray Him directily and Peter James and John began fighting for WHO's the GREATEST?
sound familiar?


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There wasnt Bozo, nor is there.
there was plenty of church before your corporate monopoly set on


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The Lords Day is not false,
dare you to google it...
what was discovered on Sunday was an empty tomb...
the first day of the week was actually written  the first of the sabbaths  in the original greek but merely translated into "first day of the week" that's why most translation have "day" italicized as it is not in the original...
so the resurrection would have been before sabbath morning dawned...
sabbath heals is the message Jesus emphasized with all His sabbath day healings...
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Jews dont dont like it, theyve been trying since his death to change his worship to their Sabbath.
ha ha ha...
Philos was one of many JOOs who taught the sabbath didnt matter and Sunday should be the new day....
The LAST thing Joos wanted were more gentile converts to crowd their synagogues...
they stoned Paul for that very thing...he kept attracting the gentile converts into the synagogues on yup Sabbath...
the same synagogues he had hunted the jesus believing joos prior his own conversion...

sabbath keeping, churchs, scriptures written and read...all before your corporate counterfeit
church universal?
just because millions celebrate christmas does not make it biblical nor something jesus asked of us...so just because the majority believe does not make it true...
there remains a remnant...an elect...





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Same $h^t, different tune.
ha ha ha...wow...you have such a way with words especially when discussing scripture...and to the words of Jesus...
again "DO NOT THINK I HAVE COME TO ABOLISH THE LAW"...got it?
the law to you is obviously dead...but not your church...it keeps eating unleavened bread

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The OLD is dead, fulfilled, invalidated and completed, the NEW is HIS.
and He said pray that the sabbath be kept even after His death...after the destrucion of the temple...
that's why Peter, Paul, kept it and even celebrated the Passover and Pentecost...
the old covenant was indeed completed and the New covenant was signed by Jesus' blood HAVING CHANGED NOTHING...

even you guys still hold on to unleavened bread because He did...but well He also kept sabbath...HELLO?
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Isaiah 1:13, "Offer sacrifice no more in vain: incense is an abomination to Me. The new moons, and the Sabbaths, and your festivals I will not abide."
and all was restored...and?

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AND in Colossians 2:16-17.
written to gentiles who kept the sabbath but were criticised by Joos for it...went over this already Walt...wow...

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Jer 31:31-34, "...and I will make a New Covenant...not according to the covenant which I made with their fathers...the covenant which THEY MADE VOID..."

covenants are contracts with specific stibulations...the stipulations never changed as the covenant was re newed...
God also made this covenant with the house of israel...is that you? ha ha ha...
if you claim it is then you must keep the same law israel did...its for the same promise...promised by faith




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And Anti Christ Jews still have it, we have the Lords Day.
and you both are in error...

Sabbath?

think about it Walt...could Paul have claimed "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the temple, nor against Ceasar have I offended in anything at all." if he was worshipping on sunday and teaching Joos to do the same? That would be breaking Joo and temple law right? He would be teaching gentiles to worship on sunday someone else beside Ceasar? Sunday was Ceasar's day...

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Hebrews 10:9-10,
'"Behold, I come to do thy will, O GOD," HE ANNULS THE FIRST COVENANT IN ORDER TO ESTABLISH THE SECOND.'
The Sabbath along with the Old Covenant is dead, the last nail driven into the coffin, and it is buried.
so we can kill? we can steal? there is no more law? yet you eat unleavened bread and practice many OT sacrements including baptism marriage prayer offerings TITHING etc...
ha ha ha yes...you do keep that OT law right Walt?...
he said "I am Lord of the sabbath" not "I am lord of tithing"...you do notice that right Walt?

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Galatians 3:10-29,
"For those who rely on the works of the Law are under a curse...BUT THAT BY THE LAW NO MAN IS JUSTIFIED BEFORE GOD IS EVIDENT, BECAUSE HE WHO IS JUST LIVES BY FAITH....

CHRIST REDEEMED US FROM THE CURSE OF THE LAW.....BUT BEFORE THE FAITH CAME WE WERE KEPT IMPRISONED UNDER THE LAW, SHUT UP FOR THE FAITH THAT WAS TO BE REVEALED.
THEREFORE THE LAW HAS BEEN OUR TUTOR UNTO CHRIST, THAT WE MIGHT BE JUSTIFIED BY FAITH. BUT NOW THAT FAITH HAS COME, WE ARE NO LONGER UNDER A TUTOR...."
so no more law? wow...and what will happen on the LORD's DAY of judgement when the law is missing?
you are silly...

jesus redeemed us from the curse of the law...not the law itself..the law remains to point out sin...



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Moron
Ive shown you time and again where Paul condemns the Sabbath and OT with it, in the books of Galatians and Colossians.
Paul condemns the Sabbath and the OT? ha ha ha...the frist european convert was baptized on the Sabbath...
Paul hurried to be in Joorusalem for passover...met with believers on the first of the sabbaths during the feast of unleavened bread and the rushed off on sunday morning...ha ha ha


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No that wasnt Fiat.
FIAT  means value by declaration...

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Fiat as it relates to money,
oh you DO understand...ha ha ha..just because someone or the church declares you saved doesnt actually save you
there is only One who will ACTUALLY do such....on the LORD's DAY of judgement....
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is fake money, backed by nothing but Jews schemes.
Indulgences were and are scriptural.

Note that God promised Abraham that, if he could find a certain number of righteous men in Sodom, he was willing to defer the city’s temporal destruction for the sake of the righteous (Gen. 18:16-33; cf. 1 Kgs. 11:11-13; Rom. 11:28-29).

Forward to the NT
For serious sins, such as apostasy, murder, and abortion, the penances could stretch over years, but the Church recognized that repentant sinners could shorten their penances by pleasing God through pious or charitable acts that expressed sorrow and a desire to make up for one’s sin.

The Church also recognized the duration of temporal punishments could be lessened through the involvement of other persons who had pleased God.
Scripture tells us God gave the authority to forgive sins "to men" (Matt. 8and to Christ’s ministers in particular. 9)
Jesus told them,
"As the Father has sent me, even so I send you. . . . Receive the Holy Ghost.
If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained" (John 20:21-23).
sins are forgiven because of a contrite spirit not  because "the coin in the coffer rings"
its natural to want to make up for a sin...but in your church history the church MADE UP DEBTS AND PAYMENTS to reduce punishment...IT DECLARED..see that's FIAT

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HE founded A Church.
built without hands...He is the head needs NO advocate sent the Spirit to be with us and thus we need no VICAR...thanks but no thanks...

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One Church. No plural. And HIS Church is the only Church that offers salvation.
the salvation the church offers is merely declared...again that's FIAT...not actual
only our belief in jesus will save us at the time of judgement
the pope will represent all who believe in him and his church...and advocate and defend them to Jesus
according to your dogma and tradition the Virgin Mary and all the saints will defend you to Jesus...

but only Jesus will save us as His Father the JUDGE will declare us saved or damned...at the time of judgement


ha ha ha the only salvation your church provides is salvation FROM it...its condemnation swords and fire...
From it and in this life...believe in it and it spares you...but it is not the final say in/on eternity


CHURCH however DOES NOT PROVIDE SOVEREIGNTY it demands obedience and submission to it its law dogma and tradition...

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We ARE The ekklessia, bozo.
you are His if you love Him and if you lovr Him you keep His commandments...those that do the Will of Hs Father are even His mother and brother and sister...

and Walt, His  Father wants obedience to His law not church traditon...

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #42 on: August 27, 2011, 06:07:48 PM »
and yet every one of the authors of the new testament were literate and wrote the gospel accounts PRIOR to the destruction of the temple...

as were the letters to the various churches in the region for the members to read...along with the old testemant which they also read...
all this literature became the new testament...
there was even much written which was NOT included....

I will stop you here.

The gospels are attributed to mark, matthew, luke, and john but they are not in the first person, and they are not signed, and the authors never say "I John saw this or that".

Christs apostles were NOT all literate,  they were Fishermen in large part, and a tax collector.
Working fishermen writing in educated GreeK?   Not likely.
Scribes more than likely wrote most of them from firsthand accounts.



The rest of your typing is usual Jew nonsense.

But thanks for spreading your cheer.




"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #43 on: August 27, 2011, 06:10:27 PM »
Clefty,

Start your own damn thread.

This has nothing to do with the topic of Sovereign Man.

If you want to debate Scripture, 
1. Like in Revelations 'Efficacious Prayers of the Saints' (ie The Virgin Mary)
2. Or Peter being Named BY Christ as the ROCK built upon Christs Church
3. Or ALMS Giving as penance and indulgence

than Im happy to do so, but stop the thread HIJACKING.

Its annoying already, you perfidious Jew.
« Last Edit: August 27, 2011, 06:17:15 PM by WaltDisney »
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #44 on: August 28, 2011, 10:43:14 AM »

Christs apostles were NOT all literate, 

slow down Walt...read my posts...

I said the authors of the new testament... not the apostles...

your claim as to no bible before 400 is false...besides they had OT

much literature was written and read in the first century by joo and gentile alike...most of it not included in the canon...


Offline clefty

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« Reply #45 on: August 28, 2011, 11:11:19 AM »
Clefty,

Start your own damn thread.

This has nothing to do with the topic of Sovereign Man.

What? read this thread again...LW asserts christianity is myth

you come defend it by claiming it is valid and not even sun worshiping

I contend it is

you and LW go at it and he leaves you to play in your sandbox

so I thought I would play with you...despite your advertising for TRAD mass

I merely assert that the church with its counterfeiting of God's law does not provide man with sovereignty but demands submission to it and its law and tradition

which as I show is not in line with the true Giver of freedom...our creator..

but you kept on with your name calling and "same $h^t different tune" and the sandbox became a litter box...ha ha ha

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If you want to debate Scripture, 
1. Like in Revelations 'Efficacious Prayers of the Saints' (ie The Virgin Mary)
2. Or Peter being Named BY Christ as the ROCK built upon Christs Church
3. Or ALMS Giving as penance and indulgence

than Im happy to do so, but stop the thread HIJACKING.
hijacking? I am merely showing that christianity is an out growth of an even older "myth" ...its root remains in the OT but it has become something else more in line with corporate monopoly

and as "historical" or "myth" either way it does not provide freedom but involves us in continuous crusades of conquest


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Its annoying already, you perfidious Jew.

then ignore it...oh and btw  I am not a joo...

Offline Rudi Jan

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« Reply #46 on: August 28, 2011, 02:13:23 PM »
What? read this thread again...LW asserts christianity is myth

Don't put words in my mouth. I asked for Walt's opinion regarding what was said in the videos. I'm just trying to uncover the truth. Myths are not necessarily fantasy and I'm sure there are elements of truth somewhere in there.

But instead I got preached at. I guess I should be used to that from Christians who have a world view confined entirely by their bible.

In any case, drop the religious squabbling on this thread and leave it or discuss common law and sovereignty. Probably too late so I thank both you and Walt for once again derailing a topic into religious BS.
Suspend all belief. Get the facts ~ Rudi
No one rules if no one obeys ~ Lao Tzu

Offline clefty

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« Reply #47 on: August 28, 2011, 08:19:00 PM »
Don't put words in my mouth.
ok but you did post
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I would like to think that Jesus existed if only because what he has to say in the NT is inspired as well as inspirational but the more I dig the more I am convinced that he did not
so
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I asked for Walt's opinion regarding what was said in the videos. I'm just trying to uncover the truth. Myths are not necessarily fantasy and I'm sure there are elements of truth somewhere in there.
yup...despite the changes made to the original, christianity still has some left...and some of it is NOT sun woship or even "based on absurd interpretations of the astronomical evidence"

but some of it is...and so it goes...

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But instead I got preached at. I guess I should be used to that from Christians who have a world view confined entirely by their bible.

In any case, drop the religious squabbling on this thread and leave it or discuss common law and sovereignty. Probably too late so I thank both you and Walt for once again derailing a topic into religious BS.
that's gonna be hard to distinguish...

Jesus Himself was annoyed with the religious BS of His time and sought to overthrow the religious order and restore personal soveriegnty through direct faith in God His Father...

in fact He championed man as direct lineage and heirs to the throne...and opened the door to ownership of that power...

for instance He gave common man power to forgive...something up until then only the priest was able to do...

when challanged by the religious authorities as to by what authority He preached He affirmed it is the PEOPLE that determine who God is not the corporate office...

of course those authorities killed Him for it and then new "church authorities" added changes and corruptions which established a whole new dogma which again oppressed the people...and yes these changes included elements of sun worship and corporate heirarchal structure again...despite what jesus tried to overthrow

God sent "His Son" to overthrow all middle men and  restore this direct connection...

so as you said
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I much prefer a faith in God than a faith in men presented as intermediaries to God,