Author Topic: The Law - Sovereigns, time to stand up! Reclaim your rights  (Read 5944 times)

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Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2011, 05:32:54 PM »
You quote second hand sources who report well after the days that Jesus supposedly lived. That certainly nails it.

Sorry, no one was around to take a Kodak or film it 2000 years ago, unless we count the shroud of Turin.
There are also letters to Caesar From Pilate, that is firsthand.
But believe as you wish.
I cited 3 sources, 1 living.   And all are objective sources without a bias.



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That's right, I'm an anti-christ Jew and a Jehovah witness. I'm sure that makes you feel better.
Nope, not you per se,  just the argument that comes from such Anti Church, anti Catholic, Anti Christian wells is generally Jew or Jehoav witness in origin.



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Always paint those seeking the truth with some label, especially a religious label. Never mind that what I'm saying is that ALL religion, as currently defined is BUNK.  I didn't just come to that conclusion yesterday, but a long, long time ago. This fellow's video seminars merely puts icing on the cake.
I didnt know belief in GOD or religion is Bunkish. 
I believe in a creator, the more intelligent philosophers, scientists and thinkers also did. 
But I dont really care what you or anyone else believes. It bothers me not.



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First off, we're talking Jesus. He never called himself 'Christ'. By his words he worshiped God. You worship man, not God. Funny how you ignore my statements in that regard.
GOD as MAN. 
When Jesus said 'I AM', HE was HIM referring to Himself as GOD.
And his followers were therefore called Christians.


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This is the Christian view... God wrote the bible. How do we know, the Bible tells us so. Talk about intellectual fallacies. But hey, believe what you want about those who
There was no Bible for 400 years after his death.
Ive never argued that point about the Bible telling me so, as its foolish.
Yet tradition was firmly established, as was worship, some of these, most in fact, are still around.



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IMHO, People who uncritically accept such lame and absurd claims of belief in men, blood and sacrifice and prostrate themselves at the feet of men have no intellectual strength at all. But hey, no offense intended even though you insulted me ten ways from Sunday. And like everyone who prefers belief to factual data, I know you didn't bother to follow any of the vids.
Unless these people have actually Read The Protocols of Zion, especially #14.

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Live on in ignorance since obviously being on your knees and kissing the hem of some pedophile who has the nerve to call himself the 'Holy father' is preferable to using your brain.

A rather low blow, considering only 1% of priests have ever been accused or charged with such crimes, and even these were plants as outlined by Jew agent Bella Dodd.

With Protest-ants, its double the rate, public school teachers, 10x the rate, and Rabbis Raping kids is off the charts at more than 10%.
But if it makes you feel better to throw out that barb, thats fine.
« Last Edit: August 20, 2011, 05:38:22 PM by WaltDisney »
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2011, 05:37:25 PM »

this sun/son of god christ king is a tool to decieve and control the masses by religious authorites...especially christ's masses materialists who seek world universal corporate religious state
Care to share with us the spelling of the words SUN & Son in Greek, Aramaic and Latin?
Its not like English, so your arguement, like usual, holds no water.


There is control all right, but its not coming from religious authorities, one of the dumbest arguments Ive read here. 
Youve set the bar lower once again, Clefty.

It is not Catholics that invented 'Corporations' or Corporatists.  That'd be a Jewish construct, Clefty.





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jesus and his followers of the way are not interested in temporal control or power
They could obtain none, Galilee and Judea were Occupied.

And, 'Baptize all Nations in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost' is not outlining an interest in control, power, teaching or influence?
Got it.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline wag

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« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2011, 05:49:53 PM »
A friend of mine here in Ohio that I work with, has become well versed in Common Law as a Sovereign.

He was just pulled over, speeding while driving a fellow employee home, this week.

He pulled the Sovereign card,
 ie  released him of his duties, told him he did not wish to contract with him, and told him,  referencing  UCC 1-207....would not sign his name, but did print it in all Caps, and underneath wrote All rights reserved. etc

"I reserve my right not to be compelled to perform under any contract,
commercial agreement or bankruptcy that I did not enter knowingly, voluntarily, and intentionally.
 And furthermore, I do not and will not accept the liability of the compelled benefit of any unrevealed contract or commercial agreement or bankruptcy."

Long story short, after running his plate, He was let go.

I'm afraid that any investment of time into mastering english common law would only be wasted when you are tased, arrested, and reintroduced to our talmudic justice system.
Nobody gets paid to tell the truth.

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #23 on: August 20, 2011, 06:28:36 PM »
I'm afraid that any investment of time into mastering english common law would only be wasted when you are tased, arrested, and reintroduced to our talmudic justice system.

Right you are.

But taping the incident and having a witness helped him.
And he was polite, but firm. 

You let officer Bubba know that he will be sued personally, and that his bass boat, truck and gun collection will soon be the property of Mr Sovereign, if he continues to violate.
This also includes the Judge if need be.

More people need to start seeking remedy by using the law, the correct law, and then suing cops and judges ie reclaiming our GOD given, Sovereign rights.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2011, 07:48:25 PM »
Care to share with us the spelling of the words SUN & Son in Greek, Aramaic and Latin?
Its not like English, so your arguement, like usual, holds no water.
how about a picture? you are too clever for words

Christ as Sol
According to the 1967 New Catholic Encyclopedia, a standard library reference, in an article on Constantine the Great:
"Besides, the Sol Invictus had been adopted by the Christians in a Christian sense, as demonstrated in the Christ as Apollo-Helios in a mausoleum (c. 250) discovered beneath St. Peter's in the Vatican." Indeed "...from the beginning of the 3rd century "Sun of Justice" appears as a title of Christ".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sol_Invictus

Constatine was quite clear no matter the spelling of Sunday...or language

Finally, in 321 CE the Emperor Constantine declared that Sunday would be the official day of rest throughout the entire Roman Empire: "On the venerable day of the Sun let the magistrates and people residing in cities rest, and let all workshops be closed. In the country however persons engaged in agriculture may freely and lawfully continue their pursuits because it often happens that another day is not suitable for gain-sowing or vine planting; lest by neglecting the proper moment for such operations the bounty of heaven should be lost."
http://www.mesharet.org/resources/sun-worship.html

So ceasar's day which was first day of the week was used by the romans as "day of our lord"...no matter how you spell sun or son...

pagans were already worshipping on that day... what's another diety to add to the list matter? but then the list was shortened...


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There is control all right, but its not coming from religious authorities, one of the dumbest arguments Ive read here.
Youve set the bar lower once again, Clefty.

It is not Catholics that invented 'Corporations' or Corporatists. That'd be a Jewish construct, Clefty.
ha ha ha
never said catholics invented corporations...and you really give the Joos too much credit although its true sun worship was prevelant in OT times and the main reason for their downfall...or being coopted by babylon..as per their writing...

as for power grabs...wow walt your history starts with catholics?...catholics are far behind...egyptians, babylonian, asseryians etc...

but catholics are nevertheless useful as a tool to keep building the 666 pyramid..as are zionist protestants so calm down....

Joos using the church or the church using modern JOOS is merely 666 of one or half a dozen of the other...ha ha ha

both church and joo seek power but are last in a long line...
"
Many see the head of Catholicism, Islam or the U.N. etc as the beast in the end and have many good reasons to believe that idea. However, through study of Scripture and ancient writings it is clear that the being that John is speaking about had been around for thousands of years before John was alive. It all goes back to Nimrod and then further to the Garden of Eden. For the days of Nimrod was a replay of the antediluvian beast. It all goes back to the Garden and the original beast (Genesis 3:1) who offered Adam & Eve the opportunity to become ‘gods’ without the tree of Life, who is Messiah Yahshua. Going from the garden and then tracing history up to John’s day and through today, the same theme is seen over and ever again. Whether it be through religious doctrine or religious symbology the same concept is seen…the desire of satan to offer mankind ‘godhood’ through the ‘tree of knowledge of good and evil.’ This is what 666 is all about…"
http://coupmedia.org/religion/mark-of-the-beast-666-unveiled-1902

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They could obtain none, Galilee and Judea were Occupied.
ha ha ha yes by ROME...

but Jesus and the disciples (finally understanding) never wanted it Walt...seriously...

the revolutionary concept that GOD is accessible directly personally and intimately WITHOUT temple church or priests is what Jesus came to share...not a new pharisee power base...

peace freedom and REST is experienced by any and all who keep the Law of God...all of it...

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And, 'Baptize all Nations in the name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost' is not outlining an interest in control, power, teaching or influence?
Got it.
do you?

its about freedom not control...certainly not killing dissenters...or setting up temporal corporate authority to collect taxes indulgences and promise salvation by FIAT

Matthew even adds "teaching them to observe all things I have commanded you" and well sunday worship wasnt taught by Jesus...

(its interesting too that this commission wasnt in the original mark manuscripts/letters/writings  immediately available to all followers and readers ad 55-68...which became part of the bible once the "church" printed all the news fit to print...
and is lacking both in the codex sinaiticus and codex vaticanus)

Offline Rudi Jan

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« Reply #25 on: August 20, 2011, 08:11:35 PM »
Sorry, no one was around to take a Kodak or film it 2000 years ago, unless we count the shroud of Turin.
There are also letters to Caesar From Pilate, that is firsthand.
But believe as you wish.
I cited 3 sources, 1 living.   And all are objective sources without a bias.

Ok, obviously fallacy is your methodology. You make an absurd statement (polaroid camera) then argue against it.

You have, on many occasions, stated your 'belief', a belief I do not share and then tell me to believe what I wish. In logic those who make a claim bear the onus of proving it, not the other way around. I have stated quite clearly the turning wheels of our universe is eerily reflected in your religion. I presented a video that supports that statement. You have presented nothing to persuade me that this is not the case except to diss the argument by associating it with Jehovah Witnesses or anti-christ Jews. I am neither Jew nor a Jehovah Witness so your point is not made. It's like telling me I'm anti-unicorn when you have yet to prove the existence of a unicorn.

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I didn't know belief in GOD or religion is Bunkish. 

That is downright sleazy. I very much believe in God... I see his hand in everything that is. But including religion in the same sentence as if they are equal in magnitude, or one and the same is sophistry, and not very good sophistry I might add.

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I believe in a creator, the more intelligent philosophers, scientists and thinkers also did. 

Appeal to respect by association. Can one be an unintelligent philosopher, scientist or thinker? Where In God's (and I invoke his name in all seriousness as a correction to any further speciousness coming from your keyboard) name did I ever deny God in all my writings here? It is clear that for all your 'beliefs' integrity of thought is no constraint to your sophistry. You really need to be a priest.

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But I dont really care what you or anyone else believes. It bothers me not.

Good, then you can stop your proselyting here as a counter to everything we try and discuss.

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GOD as MAN. 
When Jesus said 'I AM', HE was HIM referring to Himself as GOD.
And his followers were therefore called Christians.

Says you!

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There was no Bible for 400 years after his death.
Ive never argued that point about the Bible telling me so, as its foolish.
Yet tradition was firmly established, as was worship, some of these, most in fact, are still around.

Appeal to tradition. So? That is the Judaic's way.

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Unless these people have actually Read The Protocols of Zion, especially #14.

What does the Jew agenda have to do with whether or not Jesus was real or not? Do you think some Jew came along and convinced me of the horrors of Christianity and the need to destroy Christianity? Is this yet another attempt to paint me with the Jew brush? I frankly see very little difference between Jew arrogance and your Christian arrogance. Both of your religions have turned this world into an earthly hell.

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A rather low blow, considering only 1% of priests have ever been accused or charged with such crimes, and even these were plants as outlined by Jew agent Bella Dodd.

I only mentioned the one. The one all the others hold up as their 'Father'. If you or they want to be a part of the same family and venerate the one, well, one can hardly expect admiration for following such as he.

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With Protest-ants, its double the rate, public school teachers, 10x the rate, and Rabbis Raping kids is off the charts at more than 10%.
But if it makes you feel better to throw out that barb, thats fine.

Which only proves my point... get religion and find happiness in he certainty that whatever evil you commit you are exonerated on account of 'faith'. I say unto you that whatsoever a man reaps, so shall he sow. There is no 'get out of jail free card' whatever you 'believe'. This universe is perfect as God is perfect and could not create 'imperfection'. Cause and effect is the essence of that perfection. It is only man who has had the audacity to look at God's creation and judge this portion 'good' and another portion as 'evil' when in fact the evil is of his own doing. The penultimate sin of man is his penchant for judging God.

What you are arguing is that one can't simply believe in God without also accepting dogma as laid out by weak and immoral men who are seeking an out to the evil of their lives by either claiming eternal amnesty merely by 'faith' or more perversely by exalting themselves by bringing other men to their knees through corruption, murder, theft, deceit and sophistry.
Suspend all belief. Get the facts ~ Rudi
No one rules if no one obeys ~ Lao Tzu

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #26 on: August 21, 2011, 06:00:01 AM »
Ok, obviously fallacy is your methodology. You make an absurd statement (polaroid camera) then argue against it.

You have, on many occasions, stated your 'belief', a belief I do not share and then tell me to believe what I wish. In logic those who make a claim bear the onus of proving it, not the other way around. I have stated quite clearly the turning wheels of our universe is eerily reflected in your religion. I presented a video that supports that statement. You have presented nothing to persuade me that this is not the case except to diss the argument by associating it with Jehovah Witnesses or anti-christ Jews. I am neither Jew nor a Jehovah Witness so your point is not made. It's like telling me I'm anti-unicorn when you have yet to prove the existence of a unicorn.


You ask me to prove Christs existance, which I did.  Its a historical fact, that of HIS life.

Yet You have to DISPROVE....so what year is it, LW?





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What does the Jew agenda have to do with whether or not Jesus was real or not? Do you think some Jew came along and convinced me of the horrors of Christianity and the need to destroy Christianity? Is this yet another attempt to paint me with the Jew brush? I frankly see very little difference between Jew arrogance and your Christian arrogance. Both of your religions have turned this world into an earthly hell.

Protocol of Zion #14 is pretty clear.





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What you are arguing is that one can't simply believe in God without also accepting dogma as laid out by weak and immoral men who are seeking an out to the evil of their lives by either claiming eternal amnesty merely by 'faith' or more perversely by exalting themselves by bringing other men to their knees through corruption, murder, theft, deceit and sophistry.

Thats where youre off.
You call it dogma, but the sacraments were given to us by GOD and The Church, The Church HE established. 
That has nothing to do with weak and immoral men.

Jews seek to deny all sacraments-Marriage especially, and make them 'civil matters' and in turn, destroy GODs law and GOD Himself. 
Everyone with eyes can see it. Practically.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2011, 06:19:45 AM »
LW

This is quite interesting.

19 Pagan Sources/Writers who document Christ in their works. Non biblical sources, mind you.
I never knew it was that high a number. Their testimony is on record via their works. 
To disprove all of them might be quite a task, indeed.



Youtube has changed embedding once again, so Im requesting some help until I can sort it out.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LneIIfQL_HE&feature=related



LW - same 'ol as far as I can tell. I just right click on the vid and select 'copy embed html', then paste into the post, encase with [ html]...[ /html]
« Last Edit: August 21, 2011, 08:14:45 AM by LoneWolf »
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2011, 08:41:20 AM »
I thought that was exactly what I did, but no bueno on my part, thanks for the help.


The more professional and astute Scientists were Believers IN God, examples being:

Copernicus, Sir Francis Bacon, Galileo, Descartes, Isaac Newton, Kelvin, Einstein, Planck, Mendel, Farday, Robert Boyle.
I think it would be a daunting task to try to disprove them all.




PROTOCOL No. 14


1. When we come into our kingdom it will be undesirable for us that there should exist any other religion than ours (Lucifer) of the One God with whom our destiny is bound up by our position as the Chosen People and through whom our same destiny is united with the destinies of the world.
We must therefore sweep away all other forms of belief. If this gives birth to the atheists whom we see to-day, it will not, being only a transitional stage, interfere with our views, but will serve as a warning for those generations which will hearken to our preaching of the religion of Moses, that, by its stable and thoroughly elaborated system has brought all the peoples of the world into subjection to us.
Therein we shall emphasize its mystical right, on which, as we shall say, all its educative power is based .... Then at every possible opportunity we shall publish articles in which we shall make comparisons between our beneficent rule and those of past ages. The blessing of tranquillity, though it be a tranquillity forcibly brought about by centuries of agitation, will throw into higher relief the benefits to which we shall point. The errors of the GOYIM governments will be depicted by us in the most vivid hues.
We shall implant such an abhorrence of them that the peoples will prefer tranquillity in a state of serfdom to those rights of vaunted freedom which have tortured humanity and exhausted the very sources of human existence, sources which have been exploited by a mob of rascally adventurers who know not what they do ....
USELESS CHANGES OF FORMS OF GOVERNMENT TO WHICH WE INSTIGATED THE "GOYIM" WHEN WE WERE UNDERMINING THEIR STATE STRUCTURES, WILL HAVE SO WEARIED THE PEOPLES BY THAT TIME THAT THEY WILL PREFER TO SUFFER ANYTHING UNDER US RATHER THAN RUN THE RISK OF ENDURING AGAIN ALL THE AGITATIONS AND MISERIES THEY HAVE GONE THROUGH. (This "religion of Moses," the so-called "Oral Torah" or Babylonian Talmud, is the antithesis of Moses and the Prophets).


WE SHALL FORBID CHRIST

2. At the same time we shall not omit to emphasize the historical mistakes of the GOY governments which have tormented humanity for so many centuries by their lack of understanding of everything that constitutes the true good of humanity in their chase after fantastic schemes of social blessings, and have never noticed that these schemes kept on producing a worse and never a better state of the universal relations which are the basis of human life ...

3. The whole force of our principles and methods will lie in the fact that we shall present them and expound them as a splendid contrast to the dead and decomposed old order of things in social life.

4. Our philosophers will discuss all the shortcomings of the various beliefs of the "GOYIM," BUT NO ONE WILL EVER BRING UNDER DISCUSSION OUR FAITH FROM ITS TRUE POINT OF VIEW SINCE THIS WILL BE FULLY LEARNED BY NONE SAVE OURS WHO WILL NEVER DARE TO BETRAY ITS SECRETS.

5. IN COUNTRIES KNOWN AS PROGRESSIVE AND ENLIGHTENED WE HAVE CREATED A SENSELESS, FILTHY, ABOMINABLE LITERATURE. For some time after our entrance to power we shall continue to encourage its existence in order to provide a telling relief by contrast to the speeches, party program, which will be distributed from exalted quarters of ours .... Our wise men, trained to become leaders of the GOYIM, will compose speeches, projects, memoirs, articles, which will be used by us to influence the minds of the GOYIM, directing them towards such understanding and forms of knowledge as have been determined by us.

"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #29 on: August 21, 2011, 09:22:44 AM »
In the famous Catholic Church Imprimatured (Approved) Book The Talmud Unmasked, written by the erudite, Father Iustinus Bonaventura Pranaitis (A Hebrew Scholar)...
Fr. Pranaitis heroically exposed the demonic prose of the Jews blasphemic Talmud.

Fr. Pranaitis wrote:


    In numerous places in the Talmud ignominious names are given by the Jews to Christian things. It will not be out of place to list a few of these names which they give to things and persons which are held holy and dear by Christians, as follows:


  # JESUS is ignominiously called Jeschu—which means, May his name and memory be blotted out. His proper name in Hebrew is Jeschua, which means Salvation.

  # MARY, THE MOTHER OF JESUS, is called Charia—dung, excrement (German Dreck). In Hebrew her proper name is Miriam.

  # CHRISTIAN SAINTS, the word for which in Hebrew is Kedoschim, are called Kededchim (cinaedos)—feminine men (Fairies). Women saints are called Kedeschoth, whores.

  # SUNDAY is called the day of calamity.

  # FEAST OF CHRISTMAS is called Nital, denoting extermination.

  # EASTER is not called by the proper word Pesach (Passover), but Ketsach, meaning a cutting down; or Kesach, a Gallows.

  # A CHRISTIAN CHURCH is not called Beth Hattefillah, House of Prayer, but Beth Hattiflah, a House of Vanity, a House of Evil.

  # THE GOSPEL BOOKS are called Aavon Gilaion, Books of Iniquity.

  # CHRISTIAN SACRIFICES are called Dung Offerings. In the Jerusalem Talmud (fol.13b) the following occurs:
    "He who sees them mezabbelim (excrementing—sacrificing) before their idol, let him say (Exod. XXII, 20): He that sacrificeth unto an idol shall be utterly destroyed."

    Rabbi Iarchi (referring to Num. XXV, 3) teaches that the Gentiles actually honor their God by excrementing before him.

    Fr. Pranaitis in the epilouge to his book says, "Kind Reader: In this work I have quoted from only a very few of the Talmudic books which refer to the Christians.
For the sake of brevity, and to spare your sensitive soul, I omitted many others which could have been included. If it revolted you, Christian reader, to study the horrible blasphemies in this book, do not vent your anger on me. I
 did not state in the beginning that I was going to narrate something pleasant, but merely to show you what the Talmud really teaches about Christians, and I do not think I could have done so in a more suitable way."

    (The Talmud Unmasked, The Secret Rabbinical Teachings Concerning Christians, by Rev. I. B. Pranaitis, Catholic Priest, IMPRIMATUR: St. Petersburg, April 13, 1892 KOZLOWSKY ARCHBISHOP METROPOLITAN OF MOGHILEFF,C. Propolanis, S.C, Secretary)
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #30 on: August 21, 2011, 09:42:57 AM »


The more professional and astute Scientists were Believers IN God, examples being:

Copernicus, Sir Francis Bacon, Galileo, Descartes, Isaac Newton, Kelvin, Einstein, Planck, Mendel, Farday, Robert Boyle.
I think it would be a daunting task to try to disprove them all.

the existance of God is not in dispute here...church is...church who claims to be SOLE representative of God...

James said "He who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it not a forgetful hearer but doer of the work this one will be blessed in what he does"...

that is where we derive our freedoms from Walt...from doing the LAW of GOD not the church and its laws...

James did not say the perfect law of the church...nor its traditions and dogma

our soveriegnty is given to us by God, our Creator and creator of all, remember?

Freedom is ours if we claim it...not given by church or state...

the church has given freedom only to those who do not oppose her law...same for the state

your posting of the protocols is merely another example of the zealous pharisees who corrupted God's law and made it their own....

protocols were jesuit by the way...so many religions want control...

God gives freedom peace and REST


Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #31 on: August 21, 2011, 10:04:17 AM »
THE Church gave and taught us the Law(s) of GOD.
The Church that ruled, gave us our Sacraments and Western Civilization, Human Sovereign Rights for 1600 years before the Judaized Reformation.
And There is NO Plural in 'THIS ROCK, MY CHURCH', shillstein.





LW,

The Lost Books of the Bible


The General Epistle of Barnabas
Clemens Alexandrinus, Origen, Eusebius, Jerome and many other ancient church authorities deem the General Epistle of Barnabas canonical and genuine. Dr. Bernard Sullivan, a professor at Oxford University believed The General Epistle of Barnabas to be genuine and that it was read widely in the churches at Alexandria. It is supposed to have been written by Barnabas, an apostle and companion of Paul. It is considered to have been written before the Epistle of Jude and the writings of both Johns. Archbishop Wake, Dr. S. Clarke, Vossius and Dupis also declared it to be genuine. The paranormal occurances of The General Epistle of Barnabas are as follows.

The First Epistle Of Clement To The Corinthians
Clement was a disciple of Peter. According to Eusebius, The Epistle of Clement was publicly read in the early church.
It is found in one of the ancient collections of Canon Scripture. The Epistle of Clement was rejected by early church fathers because they claimed it did not honor the Trinity doctrine. The First Epistle Of Clement to the Corinthians is a letter written to the congregation of Corinth. In the letter, Clement chastises the congregation for some member's sedition and blasphemy.

The First Epistle of Clement was translated by Archbishop Wake from the ancient Greek copy of the Epistle. The original Greek version is found at the end of the Alexandrine manuscript of the Septuagint and New Testament that was presented to Charles The First. It is now in the British Museum. Clement writes of many miraculous events in his First Epistle to the Corinthians. These supernatural events are recorded below.

The Epistles Of Jesus Christ And Abgarus, King Of Edessa
In the 4th Century, Eusebius, Bishop of Caesarea, in Palestine, confirmed that he had found the Epistles of Jesus Christ And Abgarus, King of Edessa in the public registers and records of the city of Edessa in Mesopotamia. It was written in the Syriac language. Although they are considered Apocryphal, the erudite Grabe, Archbishop Cave, Dr. Parker and other church men tried strenuously to have the Epistles admitted into Scripture. The Epistles contain two letters. The first is a letter written by King Abgarus to Jesus asking for his help. The second is Jesus’ reply to the King.
The letters concern the supernatural healing powers of Christ.

The Book Of Jasher
The Book of Jasher is an ancient Hebrew manuscript. It is mentioned twice in the Bible. In the book of Joshua we find mention of The Book of Jasher at Joshua 10: 12 Then spake Joshua to the LORD in the day when the LORD delivered up the Amorites before the children of Israel, and he said in the sight of Israel, Sun, stand thou still upon Gibeon; and thou, Moon, in the valley of Ajalon.13 And the sun stood still, and the moon stayed, until the people had avenged themselves upon their enemies. Is not this written in the book of Jasher? So the sun stood still in the midst of heaven, and hasted not to go down about a whole day. 14 And there was no day like that before it or after it, that the LORD hearkened unto the voice of a man: for the LORD fought for Israel.

Jasher is also mentioned in 2 Samuel 1:17 And David lamented with this lamentation over Saul and over Jonathan his son:18 (Also he bade them teach the children of Judah the use of the bow: behold, it is written in the book of Jasher.) The Book of Jasher provides insight into the historical period from creation through the time of Joshua. This book has never actually been "lost"; it has been kept from public view for centuries and has been published very rarely until now. The Book of Jasher was said to have been found in Jerusalem during its capture by Titus. In 1840, many experts such as Professors Nordheimer, Turner and Bush of New York City proclaimed the English translation of The Book of Jasher, in general, a correct translation from the Hebrew. Although most people believe that a man named Jasher wrote the book, the Hebrew word Jasher means straight or upright. Therefore, the translated name of this book would be The Book of the Straight or Upright.
The supernatural and miraculous events recorded in The Book of Jasher are listed below.

Gospel of the Birth of Mary
The Gospel of the Birth of Mary, attributed to St. Matthew, was considered genuine and authentic by many of the ancient Christian sects. The Gospel is mentioned by several of the church fathers, including Jerome, Epiphanius, and Austin. One of the so- called Lost Books of the Bible, The Gospel of the Birth of Mary was rejected during the formulation of the Bible by various edicts and councils of the early Church. Dissension, personal jealousy, intolerance, persecution and bigotry among the churchmen contributed to the evolution of the Bible, as we know it today.
As an effect of the in-fighting among the churchmen, writings of a pure purpose and sincerity have been omitted from the Bible text. Often it is expressed, by sincere seekers of the truth, a desire to know more about the Virgin Mary and her life. The Gospel of the Birth of Mary fulfills this desire. The following comparisons of scripture taken from the Bible and the Gospel of the Birth of Mary prove the authenticity of the information contained in the Gospel of the Birth of Mary written by Matthew.

Letter of Herod To Pilate The Governor
The letters of Herod and Pilate definitely connect the death of Christ to Roman History. Three of these letters can be found in the British Museum in a Syriac MS written in the sixth or seventh century.
The letter of Herod to Pilate The Governor gives us a detailed overview of what befell Herod after the crucifixion of Christ. The following excerpts from the letter show how the divine judgments of a supernatural God are carried out.

Letter of Pilate To Herod
The following letter written by Pilate the Governor of Judea is in response to the letter written by Herod in which Herod describes all the ills that have befallen him and his household since the crucifixion of Christ. Pilate speaks of the many supernatural occurrences he himself had confirmed concerning the death and subsequent resurrection of Jesus.

The Death Of Pilate, Who Condemned Jesus
In this account of the death of Pilate, it is related that Tiberius Caesar, being very ill and not knowing that Jesus had been put to death, sends an attendant to Pilate to tell him to send the physician, Jesus, to him as quickly as possible.
When Caesar hears of the crucifixion of Christ, he commands Pilate be brought to him and Pilate is condemned to death.

The Epistle of Pontius Pilate
The Epistle of Pontius Pilate was written to Tiberius Caesar, Emperor of Rome concerning the crucifixion of Christ Jesus. In the Epistle, Pilate speaks of supernatural events connected with the death of Christ.

The Report Of Pilate The Governor
Concerning Our Lord Jesus Christ; Which Was Sent To Augustus Caesar, In Rome
Pilate sent this letter to Caesar in Rome. It is his private report of the occurrences surrounding the crucifixion of Christ. In this letter Pilate reports to Rome on the supernatural happings associated with Christ's death.

The Trial And Condemnation Of Pilate
The Trial and Condemnation of Pilate is often referred to as the Paradosis of Pilate. Many scholars believe it to be a continuation of The Epistle of Pontius Pilate. This letter pertains to a discourse between Pontius Pilate and Caesar and the events that take place during this time. Many paranormal events occurred during their discussion and the subsequent condemnation and execution of Pilate.

The Report of Pontius Pilate to Tiberius
The Report of Pontius Pilate to Tiberus was regarded as genuine by the early church fathers. It consists of a letter written by Pontius Pilate, Procurator of Judea, to Tiberius Caesar, the Emperor of Rome. The letter goes into great detail about the circumstances of the crucifixion of Christ and events immediately following Christ's death.
In this letter, Pontius Pilate, an eyewitness to these events, relates many of the miracles performed by Christ. But, most importantly, it describes in detail the supernatural happenings at the time Christ was crucified.
Presented below is evidence of the anomalies that were seen and witnessed by Pontius Pilate as related to Tiberius.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline Rudi Jan

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« Reply #32 on: August 21, 2011, 10:26:23 AM »
You ask me to prove Christs existance, which I did.  Its a historical fact, that of HIS life.

No, I did not ask you prove Christ's existence... I merely stated that the onus is on Christians to prove Jesus existed as it is their claim, not mine. As I have said I sincerely hope he did but none of the evidence has been convincing so far. Indeed, even if he did the biblical story of his life parallels a similar mythology present in the life of Krishna, Osiris and so on... is that merely coincidence?

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Yet You have to DISPROVE....so what year is it, LW?

We're going around in circles. I do not wish to DISPROVE, I'm only stating that it hasn't been proved.

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Protocol of Zion #14 is pretty clear.

Indeed, but simply because Jews wish to destroy the competition does not mean that all those who are ambivalent towards both mythologies are  necessarily the pawns of the Jews. We can rise above both. If I had to choose sides however then I would go with the Christians and deal with their mythology after the eradication of the far more evil psychopathy of Jewdom.

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Thats where youre off.
You call it dogma, but the sacraments were given to us by GOD and The Church, The Church HE established. 
That has nothing to do with weak and immoral men.

Setting aside your claim that it was given to us by GOD (all caps yet... does that make him a corporation?)
From Wikipedia: Dogma is the established belief or doctrine held by a religion, or by extension by some other group or organization. It is authoritative and not to be disputed, doubted, or diverged from, by the practitioners or believers.

Or anyone for that matter.

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Jews seek to deny all sacraments-Marriage especially, and make them 'civil matters' and in turn, destroy GODs law and GOD Himself. 
Everyone with eyes can see it. Practically.

ok... so the Jews have their dogma, for which I care not one whit... and who seek to undermine Christianity's dogma... can you not accept that some of us prefer to stay out of that dogfight? If we take one paradigm to task does that mean we are automatically proponents of another paradigm? Impugning those who do not see your POV as sufficiently substantiated by fact is not reason and is certainly not logical. It is merely the color of logic.

In any case I will research your list of non-christian evidence (again, as I am already familiar with most of it) however I am more or less of the mind that most of this 'proof' was merely the first stages of creating a blend of existing religion into a one-size-fits-all religion that would shackle free thinkers once and for all. Now here we are two thousand years later and it's all being trotted out again in what appears to me to be a desperate attempt to refit the chains on those who threaten breaking their chains and to be free again in modern times.
Suspend all belief. Get the facts ~ Rudi
No one rules if no one obeys ~ Lao Tzu

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #33 on: August 21, 2011, 02:52:36 PM »
No, I did not ask you prove Christ's existence... I merely stated that the onus is on Christians to prove Jesus existed as it is their claim, not mine. As I have said I sincerely hope he did but none of the evidence has been convincing so far. Indeed, even if he did the biblical story of his life parallels a similar mythology present in the life of Krishna, Osiris and so on... is that merely coincidence?


You say onus is on us to prove, but you cannot Disprove.
I think the onus is on you, given that we mark time itself with HIS Life... 2011AD



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We're going around in circles. I do not wish to DISPROVE, I'm only stating that it hasn't been proved.
Do not wish, or cant?




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Indeed, but simply because Jews wish to destroy the competition does not mean that all those who are ambivalent towards both mythologies are  necessarily the pawns of the Jews. We can rise above both. If I had to choose sides however then I would go with the Christians and deal with their mythology after the eradication of the far more evil psychopathy of Jewdom.

Not about destroying the competition.
Its about Destroying Judaism all together and their racket of Money lending and Usury
Unintentionally perhaps, but those that deny still are more aligned WITH Jewry & Protocol #14 than not.


Jesus taught (Luke 6:34-35)
"love ye your enemies, and do good and lend, hoping for nothing again."

Usury was the basis for Jesus's calling the money changers thieves:
 "The commerce of the world is conducted on principles as much at variance with the teachings of the master, as are the practices of a sneak thief or burglar. So the Master taught, as with whip of cords, he indignantly drove its representatives, from the sacred precincts of the Temple, denouncing them as thieves.

Every well-informed mind knows that the money changers in the Temple, on that startling occasion, were at the very center of the Jewish Banking system, and of the pitiless and grinding commerce of Palestine.


Apostle Paul, in telling his vision, said:
"And I saw another multitude of men and women, and worms consumed them. But I lamented and sighing asked the angel and said, 'Who are these?' And he said to me: These are those who exacted interest ON interest, and trusted in their riches and did not hope in God that He was their helper."


Jesus' parable on the subject of usury (Matthew 25:26-27; Luke 19:22-23)
 "only the hard, austere man, one whose conscience will not interfere with his reaping where he has not sown, and taking up where he has not laid down, would extract usury, for he makes the lord of the parable tell the servant of it:
You say I am a hard and austere man, then why did you not act accordingly, and earn me my usury as my nature demanded?"





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Setting aside your claim that it was given to us by GOD (all caps yet... does that make him a corporation?)
From Wikipedia: Dogma is the established belief or doctrine held by a religion, or by extension by some other group or organization. It is authoritative and not to be disputed, doubted, or diverged from, by the practitioners or believers.

Or anyone for that matter.

ok... so the Jews have their dogma, for which I care not one whit... and who seek to undermine Christianity's dogma...

Christian dogma is simply following the tenants of Christ. 
It really is not that hard.  Love Thy Neighbor was the essence of it.
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline clefty

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« Reply #34 on: August 21, 2011, 08:15:57 PM »
THE Church gave and taught us the Law(s) of GOD.
taught us the Law of GOD or something very close to it?...oh sure its right there in the bible but the church does otherwise...

changed or counterfeited God's law comes to mind...traditions of man replace the commandments of God

sabbath to sunday proves that...Jesus kept sabbath as did Paul and Peter...and taught the same...your church does otherwise

Peter wouldnt recognise this ekklessia....ha even you dont recognise this church as it has been "hijacked by JOOS"...

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The Church that ruled, gave us our Sacraments and Western Civilization, Human Sovereign Rights for 1600 years before the Judaized Reformation.
And There is NO Plural in 'THIS ROCK, MY CHURCH', shillstein.
This ROCK didnt keep sunday or preach it...nor did Paul...you dog returning to your own vomit...

(name calling is such fun dont you think?...makes us look intellectual and profound no?)

the greek original was ekklesia better translated as congregation...as in the congregation of israel...then merely to congregation...and finally it was church...ekklessia was NEVER church or corporate power...

keep up Walt...jesus  didnt speak greek...nor did the original.congregation of israel...or for your argument's sake, the original church...ha ha ha

"In 325 AD, "The Church" joined the State under Constantine, and it was carried through the Reformation. The Reformers, were all involved in civil government, such as John Calvin who set up the civil government in Geneva. The pope was the head of the Catholic Church and he was kicked out of England, and King Henry VIII took jurisdiction over the Church. And then when the King James version was done, it was very important for them to retain the word "church" because they had jurisdiction over it, so King James made fifteen specific edicts, as far as the translation goes, and one of those edicts (edict number three) stated that this bible was to retain the word "church" in the translation and it was not to be replaced with the word "congregation." That was his specific edict. He has no jurisdiction over the congregation (people), but he does over the church (physical buildings). So you can see he never wanted the word "assembly" associated with the original meaning of the Old Testament which meant "congregation." So he knew the correct translation, obviously, but he didn't want it in there, that way they retain control over "the church."

http://ecclesia.org/truth/ekklesia.html

in other words

Jesus came to overthrow the pharisee/temple/church with His congregation of believers who followed His commandments and all of  them...not some corporation...

Joos of His the time had hijacked His "church"...and He came to re establish direct connection with the people..all who believed Him were His ekklessia...OUTSIDE the Temple traditions...

the church sought to establish its own power and did so through counterfeiting and proclaiming salvation by FIAT

the church maintains there is no salvation outside of it...jesus taught otherwise

jesus taught if people reject and disagree...shake your sandals off of their dust and move on...the church burnt dissenters as heretics....

your church is the new pharisee allowing soveriegnty to all who submit to IT not GOD...

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #35 on: August 22, 2011, 06:31:28 PM »
taught us the Law of GOD or something very close to it?...oh sure its right there in the bible but the church does otherwise...

There was A Church hundreds of years before there was a Bible. 400 to be almost exact.


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changed or counterfeited God's law comes to mind...traditions of man replace the commandments of God
Christ reinstituted HIS own Commandment.




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sabbath to sunday proves that...Jesus kept sabbath as did Paul and Peter...and taught the same...your church does otherwise
Thread Hijack yet again, Im reporting you this time. You were warned countless times.
Christ kept Sabbath but ROSE on Sunday, the Lords Day.




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Peter wouldnt recognise this ekklessia....ha even you dont recognise this church as it has been "hijacked by JOOS"...
Just a few decades ago it was taken over, it reigned for 2000 years, the USA was taken over in far less time.

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This ROCK didnt keep sunday or preach it...nor did Paul...you dog returning to your own vomit...
Sure it did, from the earliest accounts, Christians worshipped On Resurrection Day.
Paul also kept Sunday as the Lords Day.





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the greek original was ekklesia better translated as congregation...as in the congregation of israel...then merely to congregation...and finally it was church...ekklessia was NEVER church or corporate power...

Corporate is a Jew creation, not a Church creation.
There were NO Corporations during Church reign, bozo.



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keep up Walt...jesus  didnt speak greek...nor did the original.congregation of israel...or for your argument's sake, the original church...ha ha ha
Of course HE did, and Aramaic, and Hebrew.



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"In 325 AD, "The Church" joined the State under Constantine, and it was carried through the Reformation. The Reformers, were all involved in civil government, such as John Calvin who set up the civil government in Geneva.
Calvin was a Jew nee Cohen.


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The pope was the head of the Catholic Church and he was kicked out of England, and King Henry VIII took jurisdiction over the Church.
Yes, the Pope wouldnt grant the King his divorce as his wife couldnt 'bear' him a son, only daughters, so she was put to death, as was the person that introduced them, and the King forced to start his own new religion.
He married 6 times in all.  A very pious man, no doubt who took the sacrament of Marriage, most seriously.


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And then when the King James version was done, it was very important for them to retain the word "church" because they had jurisdiction over it, so King James made fifteen specific edicts, as far as the translation goes, and one of those edicts (edict number three) stated that this bible was to retain the word "church" in the translation and it was not to be replaced with the word "congregation."
Well over 150 mistranslations in the King James Bible.
You do know he was a sodomite queer, dont you?









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the church sought to establish its own power and did so through counterfeiting and proclaiming salvation by FIAT
There was NO Fiat during the Reign of the Catholic Church for well over 1600+ years.
It is a Jew creation. Nice try though.




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the church maintains there is no salvation outside of it...jesus taught otherwise
No, HE didnt. Salvation isof Christ, and HE established ONE Church, THIS Church, theres no plural.



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jesus taught if people reject and disagree...shake your sandals off of their dust and move on...the church burnt dissenters as heretics....
Nah, the secular authorities sometimes did burn Jew subverters, traitors and Muslim financiers,
Burnings occurred in Protestant communitities as well.
Salem Witch trials anyone?   Your lot likes to leave that part out.



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your church is the new pharisee allowing soveriegnty to all who submit to IT not GOD...
MY Church, The Catholic Church, was established BY Christ Himself.
Submiting to it and obtaining the sacraments from it, is submitting To GOD.
'THIS ROCK, MY CHURCH.'



Funny thing about Clefty....
In 1000 posts, he has yet to offer which Christian sect, if any, he  is a part of, and which one of the 35,000 Protest-ant Judaized sects today, is the sole source of salvation.
« Last Edit: August 22, 2011, 06:41:57 PM by WaltDisney »
"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline Rudi Jan

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« Reply #36 on: August 23, 2011, 05:09:36 PM »
You say onus is on us to prove, but you cannot Disprove.

I guess you know nothing about logic. Those who make a claim must prove it. This is true in law as it is in religion. Telling me I must disprove your claim is as childish as it gets. Your perception of common law all goes by the wayside  with such a statement, repeated ad finitum.

In any case, I've had enough of this discussion. You've skirted every point I've made with your sophistry and insinuations against my character. If you're an example of being 'Christian' then you are welcome to it.

I'll leave you to play in your little sandbox.
Suspend all belief. Get the facts ~ Rudi
No one rules if no one obeys ~ Lao Tzu

Offline clefty

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« Reply #37 on: August 23, 2011, 07:35:10 PM »
There was A Church hundreds of years before there was a Bible. 400 to be almost exact.

the bible was the letters written by the apostles and the gospels written to the ekklessia...bad argument already been over that...or do you really think they werent delivered?

you used to argue there was no church before yours...ha ha ha

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Christ reinstituted HIS own Commandment.
a house divided cannot stand...His own commandment was HIS FATHER's...





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Thread Hijack yet again, Im reporting you this time. You were warned countless times.
Christ kept Sabbath but ROSE on Sunday, the Lords Day
then ignore my posts...you arent reading them anyway

Sunday resurrection is false...and even that myth is falling...He rose to be ready for FIRST FRUIT presentation...yup another JOOish OT festival...

all in accordance to scripture...He changed nothing...or He would have said so...but He said "think not that I have come to abolish the law"...got it?



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Just a few decades ago it was taken over, it reigned for 2000 years, the USA was taken over in far less time.
appropriate choice of words...
you church STILL reigns...

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Sure it did, from the earliest accounts, Christians worshipped On Resurrection Day.
Paul also kept Sunday as the Lords Day.
in the greek "first of the sabbaths" is still sabbath ...

think about it Walt...could Paul have claimed "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the temple, nor against Ceasar have I offended in anything at all." if he was worshipping on sunday and teaching Joos to do the same? That would be breaking Joo and temple law right? He would be teaching gentiles to worship on sunday someone else beside Ceasar? Sunday was Ceasar's day...

Paul did not keep first day nor did he write to teach of it...none of the biblical authors did...



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Corporate is a Jew creation, not a Church creation.
There were NO Corporations during Church reign, bozo.
you sure give Joos alot of credit...


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There was NO Fiat during the Reign of the Catholic Church for well over 1600+ years.
It is a Jew creation. Nice try though.
when the church issues a sealed and signed paper declaring time of from purgatory or hell or limbo... that is FIAT...indulgences were paid for and FIAT was given...



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No, HE didnt. Salvation isof Christ, and HE established ONE Church, THIS Church, theres no plural.
even God made Saul king...but humans corrupt....

Salvation is of Jesus is true...and HE established MY ekklessia...congregation...believers...NOT something made by hands...besides He did not say salvation is gained through this ekklessia...but He states that He alone saves...


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Nah, the secular authorities sometimes did burn Jew subverters, traitors and Muslim financiers,
Burnings occurred in Protestant communitities as well.
Salem Witch trials anyone?   Your lot likes to leave that part out.
never claimed they didnt...that's the problem with church and its dogma...you are with us or against us...

believe as we do or we bomb you...how is that not the NWO? ha ha ha


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MY Church, The Catholic Church, was established BY Christ Himself.
Submiting to it and obtaining the sacraments from it, is submitting To GOD.
'THIS ROCK, MY CHURCH.'
insisting on primacy of peter...meant you divided the ekklessia



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Funny thing about Clefty....
In 1000 posts, he has yet to offer which Christian sect, if any, he  is a part of, and which one of the 35,000 Protest-ant Judaized sects today, is the sole source of salvation.
not part of any...they are not the sole source of salvation...church dont save you...

your pope may try to advocate for you...but good luck with that one since you reject this one...

but you best be careful and submit as he as leader of your church....he gives you your rights and sovereignty and in your case your salvation...
« Last Edit: August 23, 2011, 07:56:11 PM by clefty »

Offline WaltDisney

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« Reply #38 on: August 26, 2011, 04:09:53 PM »
the bible was the letters written by the apostles and the gospels written to the ekklessia...bad argument already been over that...or do you really think they werent delivered?
Only a sick Apostaet Jew can write such garbage.
Most of the world was illiterate.
There was no printing press, no widespread reading of the Bible, or no bible itself for 400 years and those were in small number.
The CHURCH was the Christian body of believers, United and Universal.


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you used to argue there was no church before yours...ha ha ha
 a house divided cannot stand...His own commandment was HIS FATHER's...
There wasnt Bozo, nor is there.






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Sunday resurrection is false...and even that myth is falling...He rose to be ready for FIRST FRUIT presentation...yup another JOOish OT festival...
The Lords Day is not false, Jews dont dont like it, theyve been trying since his death to change his worship to their Sabbath.




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all in accordance to scripture...He changed nothing...or He would have said so...but He said "think not that I have come to abolish the law"...got it?
Same shit, different tune.
The OLD is dead, fulfilled, invalidated and completed,  the NEW is HIS.

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Isaiah 1:13, "Offer sacrifice no more in vain: incense is an abomination to Me. The new moons, and the Sabbaths, and your festivals I will not abide."
AND in Colossians 2:16-17.

Jer 31:31-34, "...and I will make a New Covenant...not according to the covenant which I made with their fathers...the covenant which THEY MADE VOID..."



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appropriate choice of words...
you church STILL reigns...
 in the greek "first of the sabbaths" is still sabbath ...
And Anti Christ Jews still have it, we have the Lords Day.



think about it Walt...could Paul have claimed "Neither against the law of the Jews, nor against the temple, nor against Ceasar have I offended in anything at all." if he was worshipping on sunday and teaching Joos to do the same? That would be breaking Joo and temple law right? He would be teaching gentiles to worship on sunday someone else beside Ceasar? Sunday was Ceasar's day...

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Hebrews 10:9-10,
'"Behold, I come to do thy will, O GOD," HE ANNULS THE FIRST COVENANT IN ORDER TO ESTABLISH THE SECOND.'
The Sabbath along with the Old Covenant is dead, the last nail driven into the coffin, and it is buried.

Galatians 3:10-29,
"For those who rely on the works of the Law are under a curse...BUT THAT BY THE LAW NO MAN IS JUSTIFIED BEFORE GOD IS EVIDENT, BECAUSE HE WHO IS JUST LIVES BY FAITH....

CHRIST REDEEMED US FROM THE CURSE OF THE LAW.....BUT BEFORE THE FAITH CAME WE WERE KEPT IMPRISONED UNDER THE LAW, SHUT UP FOR THE FAITH THAT WAS TO BE REVEALED.
THEREFORE THE LAW HAS BEEN OUR TUTOR UNTO CHRIST, THAT WE MIGHT BE JUSTIFIED BY FAITH. BUT NOW THAT FAITH HAS COME, WE ARE NO LONGER UNDER A TUTOR...."




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Paul did not keep first day nor did he write to teach of it...none of the biblical authors did...
Moron
Ive shown you time and again where Paul condemns the Sabbath and OT with it, in the books of Galatians and Colossians.


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you sure give Joos alot of credit...
I have a respect for all dangerous creatures.


 
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when the church issues a sealed and signed paper declaring time of from purgatory or hell or limbo... that is FIAT...indulgences were paid for and FIAT was given...
No that wasnt Fiat. 
Fiat as it relates to money, is fake money, backed by nothing but Jews schemes.
Indulgences were and are scriptural.

Note that God promised Abraham that, if he could find a certain number of righteous men in Sodom, he was willing to defer the city’s temporal destruction for the sake of the righteous (Gen. 18:16-33; cf. 1 Kgs. 11:11-13; Rom. 11:28-29).

Forward to the NT
For serious sins, such as apostasy, murder, and abortion, the penances could stretch over years, but the Church recognized that repentant sinners could shorten their penances by pleasing God through pious or charitable acts that expressed sorrow and a desire to make up for one’s sin.

The Church also recognized the duration of temporal punishments could be lessened through the involvement of other persons who had pleased God.
Scripture tells us God gave the authority to forgive sins "to men" (Matt. 9:8) and to Christ’s ministers in particular.
Jesus told them,
"As the Father has sent me, even so I send you. . . . Receive the Holy Ghost.
If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained" (John 20:21-23).






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Salvation is of Jesus is true...and HE established MY ekklessia...congregation...believers...NOT something made by hands...besides He did not say salvation is gained through this ekklessia...but He states that He alone saves...
HE founded A Church.
One Church.  No plural.  And HIS Church is the only Church that offers salvation.




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insisting on primacy of peter...meant you divided the ekklessia
We ARE The ekklessia, bozo.

"I hardly exaggerate. Jewish life consists of two elements: Extracting money and protesting."
-Nahum Goldmann, Ex-President of the World Jewish Congress

Offline irmatvep

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- The Law - Sovereigns, time to stand up! Reclaim your rights
« Reply #39 on: August 26, 2011, 05:32:39 PM »
Thank you Walt.

Yes thank you for this Walt.  Even though you and I have had our differences in the past both our hearts are in the same place.  You are a damn good apologist. 

Basically it all boils down to a matter of faith, either you have it or you don't.