Author Topic: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty  (Read 9164 times)

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Offline E_T

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A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
Robert Stark
June 9, 2009


        Yesterday was the 42nd anniversary of the brutal attack on the US Navy ship, The USS Liberty by the State of Israel. On that day 34  Americans were murdered in cold blood by the government of Israel. The US government and establishment media has for the last 42 years silenced any discussion of the attacks. Israel attacked the Liberty in order to blame it on Egypt [most likely] and drag us into war on their behalf.

The Israeli government and propagandist in the media and US government have promoted the lie that the attack was an accident. That couldn't be further from the truth. If Americans knew the truth it would challenge our close alliance and unconditional support for the state of Israel. Please watch Phil Tourney's speech, USS Liberty survivor, where he tells the whole story of the event from a 1st hand account and how our government has suppressed the rights of the survivors to speak out about what happened to them.

The Americans who lost their lives and the survivors deserve justice and the American people deserve to know what happened. The powers that be do not want us to know the truth because it will challenge our unconditional support for Israel, which is a bases for much of our policy in the middle east. Our government has long put the interest of a foreign nation over our own.

http://www.examiner.com/x-9462-LA-Ron-Paul-Examiner~y2009m6d9-A-reflection-on-the-anniversary-of-the-attack-against-the-USS-Liberty

« Last Edit: June 12, 2009, 11:49:56 PM by E_T »
Rest satisfied with doing well, and leave others to talk of you as they will.
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Offline gelignite

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The US government and establishment media has for the last 42 years silenced any discussion of the attacks.

That's a lie.

In fact, there has been much discussion of the event in the media, from the time the attacks occurred to the present.

http://www.thelibertyincident.com/gag-orders-debunked.html

Therein, you will find a PDF link which lists various articles regarding the Liberty Incident. As you will note, the news media was rife with stories, including some which included survivor statements (not all of which favorable to the Israelis).

Quote
Israel attacked the Liberty in order to blame it on Egypt [most likely] and drag us into war on their behalf.

Not true.

Israel attacked the ship with boats which were clearly marked with flags from the IDF Navy (i.e., the Star of David). Since there was no Egyptian Air Force to speak of at that point in the war, it could only have been assumed that the planes involved were of Israeli origin. In short, there was no possible way to blame Egypt for what happened.

And, in fact, Israel did admit culpability for the attack immediately afterwards.

Quote
The Israeli government and propagandist in the media and US government have promoted the lie that the attack was an accident.

Such was more-or-less the finding of the Navy Court of Inquiry, which interviewed many of the crew members who were on board, including the ship's CO.

http://www.ussliberty.com/nci.txt

Quote
If Americans knew the truth it would challenge our close alliance and unconditional support for the state of Israel.

Americans do know the truth. And they support Israel more than ever.


As it should be.
I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)

Offline E_T

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Still after 42 years, Israel and its Apologists still bombard the USS Liberty with Napalm = Gel-IGINITE.

The fact is...

The USS Liberty Survivors have Debunked the Liar Cristol and his liberty incident so kindly provided above via his shill.

This war crime and act of treason is still hushed up by our msm a self-evident truth.   Although, via local news and scant documentaries and off the beaten track websites... momentum is being gained on exposing this treachery.

Insiders have come forth and set the recored straight.  Please see this forum under The USS Liberty section:  http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?board=57.0


People are just learning that the Court of Inquiry was falsified. The Court's own legal counsel, Captain Ward Boston, now says publicly in Navy Times and elsewhere that the court actually believed that the attack was deliberate but reported otherwise falsely because it was so ordered by Washington.

http://www.ussliberty.org/history405.htm


Also, these constant lies by this shill have been addressed repeatedly - and I don't care to waste my time on a disingenuous traitor.

The Big Lie


Ahron Jay Cristol  of the liberty incident website linked by mr. napalm above.
A. Jay Cristol, a U.S. bankruptcy court judge who wrote `The Liberty Incident,` said in the book that 10 U.S. and three Israeli investigations have found no evidence of any Israeli intent to attack an American ship.

USS Liberty

http://www.ussliberty.org/thebiglie.htm

http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?topic=13320.msg116159#msg116159

And to you, Mr. Napalm.

Under the Moorer Commission and even more recently again under Cpt Ward Boston, it is ascertained that the 1967 inquiry was conducted under a cover-up and was falsified.  Yet you keep posting it to support your traitorous Israel Apologist Agenda as well as the debunked by the USS Liberty - Ahron Cristol lies.  Stop peddling (spamming) your bs in order to conceal the facts.

New facts have come to light since the 1967 cover-up Inquiry.

That there has been an official cover-up without precedent in American naval history; the existence of such a cover-up is now supported by statements of Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, USN (Ret.), former Judge Advocate General of the Navy; and Captain Ward Boston, USN, (Ret.), the chief counsel to the Navy's 1967 Court of Inquiry of Liberty attack;

http://www.gtr5.com/evidence/moorer.htm

Captain McGonagles 1998 letter to Clinton

http://www.ussliberty.org/mcg2prez.htm


http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?board=57.0

http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?topic=13369.msg117406#msg117406

Here are the facts:

http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?topic=13369.msg117151#msg117151
Rest satisfied with doing well, and leave others to talk of you as they will.
Pythagoras (BC 582-BC 507) Greek philosopher

Offline TheFetch

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That's a lie.

It is absolutely PATHETIC TO WATCH YOU JEWS jump in on every tid bit of conversation regarding this event.  Gelignite - you are a total pathetic moron.  The way you go about shilling for a society of psychopaths goes beyond any sense of rationalism or logic.  Your ENTIRE ARGUMENT validates the

FACT THAT THE MEDIA IS A JEWISH DUMB AS SHIT PAID FOR ORGAN OF THE JEWISH STATE -

As such - WHATEVER LAME DISCUSSION is colored by Jewish sensibilities.  THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A FAIR AND ACCURATE REPORTING OF THIS CRIME AND ACT OF WAR BY JEWS AGAINST THE UNITED STATES from without and WITHIN.

Quote
Therein, you will find a PDF link which lists various articles regarding the Liberty Incident. As you will note, the news media was rife with stories, including some which included survivor statements (not all of which favorable to the Israelis).

Another SAD PATHETIC ATTEMPT by you to play the Jewish card.  Are you a total loser or should we capitalize the word LOSER with the caveat that LOSER really means racist Jewish piece of trash?

Quote
Israel attacked the ship with boats which were clearly marked with flags from the IDF Navy (i.e., the Star of David). Since there was no Egyptian Air Force to speak of at that point in the war, it could only have been assumed that the planes involved were of Israeli origin. In short, there was no possible way to blame Egypt for what happened.

Really?  Is this a Jewish line or some LOSERS line?  I have never heard this lame line before...is this the JEWISH LIE going around?  The American story is that Jews attacked the ship intentionally and then used their agents very high within the United States government, as well as their media assets, to cover up the ACT OF WAR by the Jewish state against the United States.

So this lame story of yours is the Jews are spinning this?  Do people actually believe the TOTAL LYING CRAP you are putting forward?  I bet you believe in the Holocaust (TM), 9-11, the Warren Report, among so many other fraudulently crafted Jewish lies?

Quote
And, in fact, Israel did admit culpability for the attack immediately afterwards.

They have NEVER ADMITTED THAT THIS WAS AN ACT OF WAR against the United States, which is what is remains to this day.  All they have admitted to is a series of LIES that TRAITORS (LOSERS) like you repeat AD NAUSEUM...

Quote
Such was more-or-less the finding of the Navy Court of Inquiry, which interviewed many of the crew members who were on board, including the ship's CO.

Of course it was.  Are you a total stupid two year old, or do you believe in the Holocaust, 9-11 (as told), and the Warren Report too?  Boy you come off as  a pathetic total moron and childish lame as shit idiot.
Quote
Americans do know the truth. And they support Israel more than ever.


As it should be.

Wow..if that is not straight out of the Jewish media play, it would have to be viewed as so sick and pathetic.  You are right Gefiltefish.  Alot of us Americans DO KNOW THE TRUTH OF THIS ACT OF WAR against the United States and we have LONG AGO VIEWED JEWS as enemies of the United States -

As it should be.

Israel is a pariah state for a pariah people.

Offline gelignite

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People are just learning that the Court of Inquiry was falsified.

Not even Ward Boston said that the Inquiry proceedings were "falsified". For the most part, Boston has suggested (based on little more than hearsay) that the Court's findings were pre-ordained, and that there was some testimony that had been omitted from the record (that of one Lloyd Painter, according to his recollection).

As for the Court transcripts themselves (i.e., the record of sworn testimony from the Liberty's crew), there is nothing whatsoever to suggest that any of the crew testified falsely, and none have ever come forward to indicate that the record of their testimony had been altered in any way. Here is a link to the transcript:

http://www.ussliberty.com/nci.txt

Therein, one can find the testimony of William McGonagle, who testified to the Court as to the following:

1. Contrary to the notion that the attack was a sustained one that lasted "two hours" (or more), the total duration of time that the Liberty had been taken under attack was about 45 minutes.

2. The Israeli boats had initially approached the Liberty flashing signals by lamp.

3. It had occurred to McGonagle that the Israeli attack may have been in error.

4. In spite of McGonagle's orders to hold fire, two of the Liberty's guns opened fire upon the approaching boats as they were attempting to signal the ship.

5. It was after this action that the Israeli boats returned fire, and a torpedo was sighted in the water.

6. Immediately after the torpedo struck the ship, the Israeli boats milled around the stern. They eventually left the area with no further attack.

Quote
A. Jay Cristol, a U.S. bankruptcy court judge who wrote "The Liberty Incident," said in the book that 10 U.S. and three Israeli investigations have found no evidence of any Israeli intent to attack an American ship.

Yes, that's absolutely correct.

Here are links to some of them:

http://www.thelibertyincident.com/JCSreport.html

http://www.thelibertyincident.com/senateinvestigation.html

http://www.thelibertyincident.com/house-investigation-1971.html

http://www.thelibertyincident.com/house-investigation-1991.html
I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)

Offline gelignite

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Another SAD PATHETIC ATTEMPT by you to play the Jewish card.  Are you a total loser or should we capitalize the word LOSER with the caveat that LOSER really means racist Jewish piece of trash?

Still following me around with the insults and abuse, I see.


We shall have to do something about that.
I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)

Offline E_T

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Not even Ward Boston said that the Inquiry proceedings were "falsified". For the most part, Boston has suggested (based on little more than hearsay) that the Court's findings were pre-ordained, and that there was some testimony that had been omitted from the record (that of one Lloyd Painter, according to his recollection).




As for the Court transcripts themselves (i.e., the record of sworn testimony from the Liberty's crew), there is nothing whatsoever to suggest that any of the crew testified falsely, and none have ever come forward to indicate that the record of their testimony had been altered in any way. Here is a link to the transcript:

http://www.ussliberty.com/nci.txt

Therein, one can find the testimony of William McGonagle, who testified to the Court as to the following:

1. Contrary to the notion that the attack was a sustained one that lasted "two hours" (or more), the total duration of time that the Liberty had been taken under attack was about 45 minutes.

2. The Israeli boats had initially approached the Liberty flashing signals by lamp.

3. It had occurred to McGonagle that the Israeli attack may have been in error.

4. In spite of McGonagle's orders to hold fire, two of the Liberty's guns opened fire upon the approaching boats as they were attempting to signal the ship.

5. It was after this action that the Israeli boats returned fire, and a torpedo was sighted in the water.

6. Immediately after the torpedo struck the ship, the Israeli boats milled around the stern. They eventually left the area with no further attack.

People are just learning that the Court of Inquiry was falsified. The Court's own legal counsel, Captain Ward Boston, now says publicly in Navy Times and elsewhere that the court actually believed that the attack was deliberate but reported otherwise falsely because it was so ordered by Washington.

http://www.ussliberty.org/history405.htm



Declaration of
Ward Boston, Jr.,Captain, JAGC, USN (Ret.)

Counsel to the U.S. Navy Court of Inquiry`s investigation into the Israeli attack on the USS Liberty
Despite the short amount of time we were given, we gathered a vast amount of evidence, including hours of heartbreaking testimony from the young survivors.

The evidence was clear. Both Admiral Kidd and I believed with certainty that this attack, which killed 34 American sailors and injured 172 others, was a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and murder its entire crew. Each evening, after hearing testimony all day, we often spoke our private thoughts concerning what we had seen and heard. I recall Admiral Kidd repeatedly referring to the Israeli forces responsible for the attack as `murderous bastards.` It was our shared belief, based on the documentary evidence and testimony we received first hand, that the Israeli attack was planned and deliberate, and could not possibly have been an accident.

Regrettably, we did not receive into evidence and the Court did not consider any of the more than sixty witness declarations from men who had been hospitalized and were unable to testify in person.

I am outraged at the efforts of the apologists for Israel in this country to claim that this attack was a case of `mistaken identity.`

In particular, the recent publication of Jay Cristol`s book, The Liberty Incident, twists the facts and misrepresents the views of those of us who investigated the attack.



Admiral Kidd and I both felt it necessary to travel to Israel to interview the Israelis who took part in the attack. Admiral Kidd telephoned Admiral McCain to discuss making arrangements. Admiral Kidd later told me that Admiral McCain was adamant that we were not to travel to Israel or contact the Israelis concerning this matter.

It is Cristol`s insidious attempt to whitewash the facts that has pushed me to speak out.

I know from personal conversations I had with Admiral Kidd that President Lyndon Johnson and Secretary of Defense Robert McNamara ordered him to conclude that the attack was a case of `mistaken identity` despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary.

Admiral Kidd told me, after returning from Washington, D.C. that he had been ordered to sit down with two civilians from either the White House or the Defense Department, and rewrite portions of the court`s findings.

Admiral Kidd also told me that he had been ordered to `put the lid` on everything having to do with the attack on USS Liberty. We were never to speak of it and we were to caution everyone else involved that they could never speak of it again.

I have no reason to doubt the accuracy of that statement as I know that the Court of Inquiry transcript that has been released to the public is not the same one that I certified and sent off to Washington.

I know this because it was necessary, due to the exigencies of time, to hand correct and initial a substantial number of pages. I have examined the released version of the transcript and I did not see any pages that bore my hand corrections and initials. Also, the original did not have any deliberately blank pages, as the released version does. Finally, the testimony of Lt. Painter concerning the deliberate machine gunning of the life rafts by the Israeli torpedo boat crews, which I distinctly recall being given at the Court of Inquiry and included in the original transcript, is now missing and has been excised.

Contrary to the misinformation presented by Cristol and others, it is important for the American people to know that it is clear that Israel is responsible for deliberately attacking an American ship and murdering American sailors, whose bereaved shipmates have lived with this egregious conclusion for many years.

Dated: January 9, 2004
at Coronado, California.
Ward Boston, Jr., Captain, JAGC, USN (Ret.)
Senior Counsel to the USS Liberty Court of Inquiry


http://www.ifamericansknew.org/us_ints/ul-boston.html


1. Contrary to the notion that the attack was a sustained one that lasted "two hours" (or more), the total duration of time that the Liberty had been taken under attack was about 45 minutes.

CONGRESSIONAL MEDAL OF HONOR SOCIETY
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
CHARTERED BY THE CONGRESS


FROM THE DESK OF:
CAPTAIN WILLIAM L. McGONAGLE, USN (RET.)
MEMBER, CMOH SOCIETY
October 24, 1998

AN OPEN LETTER TO PRESIDENT CLINTON



When the attack began about 2:00 p.m. (local time) the ship was subjected to relentless and repeated murderous fire from the attacking aircraft (which were unmarked - a violation of international law). The gun crews of the two (2) bow .50 cal. machine guns were killed during the initial strike on the ship. We could not man the starboard bridge level .50 cal. machine gun, because our life boat was burning (1) deck below and the heat did not allow anyone to approach the gun. We could not man the port bridge level .50 cal. machine gun, because two (2) 55 gallon gasoline drums were burning furiously one (1) deck below. Again the heat of the flames prevented anyone from approaching the gun. WE WERE DEFENSELESS against the onslaught of eight 8 or more firing passes by at least four (4) aircraft, and the strafing and launching of five (5) torpedoes by three (3) motor torpedo boats. That a larger number of casualties was not reported is a tribute to the fighting spirit of the officers, crew, civilians, and Marines, when they had nothing to defend themselves with, during our awesome hours of peril.
http://www.ussliberty.org/mcg2prez.htm

3. It had occurred to McGonagle that the Israeli attack may have been in error.

CAPTAIN WILLIAM L. McGONAGLE:  3. Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD to the Government of Israel until and unless the Government of Israel acknowledges, in writing and publicly, that the Government of Israel's armed forces (air and naval) deliberately attacked USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5) (A Technical Research Ship) on June 8, 1967.

4. In spite of McGonagle's orders to hold fire, two of the Liberty's guns opened fire upon the approaching boats as they were attempting to signal the ship.

5. It was after this action that the Israeli boats returned fire, and a torpedo was sighted in the water.


USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5), a Technical Research ship was sailing legally and peacefully, in international waters in the Eastern Mediterranean Sea, twelve and one-half (12.5) nautical miles from the nearest land off the coast of Sinai, during the Arab-Israeli SIX Day war, when it was attacked, without warning or provocation, by four (4) unidentified jet fighter aircraft, firing rockets, machine guns, and napalm. The ship was then strafed and torpedoed by three (3) Israeli motor torpedo boats. One (1) torpedo exploded in the Research spaces of the ship, where it caused the majority of the fatalities. The Government of Israel shortly after the attack acknowledged that their armed forces conducted the assault. The apology for the attack was accepted, but the reason for the attack as "misidentification" was never accepted by the US Government.

This is the only US Navy ship attacked by a foreign nation, involving a large loss of life and so many personnel injured that has never been accorded a full Congressional hearing.




CONGRESSIONAL MEDAL OF HONOR SOCIETY
UNITED STATES OF AMERICA
CHARTERED BY THE CONGRESS


FROM THE DESK OF:
CAPTAIN WILLIAM L. McGONAGLE, USN (RET.)
MEMBER, CMOH SOCIETY
October 24, 1998

AN OPEN LETTER TO PRESIDENT CLINTON

Re: Jonathan POLLARD

1. Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD, a convicted traitor of the United States, to the Government of Israel, as part of the Middle East peace process, or for any other reason.

2. Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD to the Government of Israel where he could continue to cause irreparable security harm to the United States of America.

3. Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD to the Government of Israel until and unless the Government of Israel acknowledges, in writing and publicly, that the Government of Israel's armed forces (air and naval) deliberately attacked USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5) (A Technical Research Ship) on June 8, 1967.

Israeli aircraft conducted surveillance of the ship within moments of our arrival on station off the coast of the Sinai on the morning of June 8, 1967. The ship was soon identified as USS LIBERTY by Israeli Naval Headquarters, by referring to "JANE'S FIGHTING SHIPS" 1966 OR 1967 issue, which showed a photograph of the ship and listed in detail its characteristics. In fact, an identification "tower" was placed on their Battle Plot with an "A" on the tower to identify the ship as an American ship. The plot was not kept up to date, and was removed when the watch changed at noon that day. The ship was overflown on several occasions before the attack commenced. An Israeli Naval Officer went to the American Embassy Naval Attache' to obtain information that the ship was indeed USS LIBERTY, but the US Naval Attache' did not have our operating schedule, so he could neither confirm or deny that the ship was the USS LIBERTY.

When the attack began about 2:00 p.m. (local time) the ship was subjected to relentless and repeated murderous fire from the attacking aircraft (which were unmarked - a violation of international law). The gun crews of the two (2) bow .50 cal. machine guns were killed during the initial strike on the ship. We could not man the starboard bridge level .50 cal. machine gun, because our life boat was burning (1) deck below and the heat did not allow anyone to approach the gun. We could not man the port bridge level .50 cal. machine gun, because two (2) 55 gallon gasoline drums were burning furiously one (1) deck below. Again the heat of the flames prevented anyone from approaching the gun. WE WERE DEFENSELESS against the onslaught of eight 8 or more firing passes by at least four (4) aircraft, and the strafing and launching of five (5) torpedoes by three (3) motor torpedo boats. That a larger number of casualties was not reported is a tribute to the fighting spirit of the officers, crew, civilians, and Marines, when they had nothing to defend themselves with, during our awesome hours of peril.

ADDITION BACKGROUND:

USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5), a Technical Research ship was sailing legally and peacefully, in international waters in the Eastern Mediterranean Sea, twelve and one-half (12.5) nautical miles from the nearest land off the coast of Sinai, during the Arab-Israeli SIX Day war, when it was attacked, without warning or provocation, by four (4) unidentified jet fighter aircraft, firing rockets, machine guns, and napalm. The ship was then strafed and torpedoed by three (3) Israeli motor torpedo boats. One (1) torpedo exploded in the Research spaces of the ship, where it caused the majority of the fatalities. The Government of Israel shortly after the attack acknowledged that their armed forces conducted the assault. The apology for the attack was accepted, but the reason for the attack as "misidentification" was never accepted by the US Government.

Thirty-four (34) officers, sailors, a civilian, and a US Marine were killed or died of their wounds as a result of the attack. One hundred seventy-one (171) additional crew members received wounds as a result of the attack. The Government of Israel did compensate the families of those killed, the individuals that were wounded, and eventually paid reparations for the damage done to the ship and its equipment. The ship remained afloat, in spite of the extensive hull damage from the torpedo explosion, and after hull repairs in Malta, the ship returned to Little Creek, VA, apparently to avoid undue publicity that the ship probably would have received had it returned to its home port of Norfolk, VA. No high level Executive Branch members welcomed the ship home to the USA, as was the practice in later years, such as the Battleship IOWA, and other incidences.

Except for a few high ranking naval officers, no one has felt our pain of not knowing exactly why the ship was attacked. Over thirty-one (31) years after the attack, the crew is entitled to know the details concerning the attack by the Government of Israel and also the details of the role the US Government in the entire affair. Why were our aircraft recalled to their carriers on two (2) occasions before they reached our location to assess the situation, and what official ordered the recall after "Hot Line" communication was established with Moscow to alert Nasser that the planes were being sent to see what the condition of USS LIBERTY was? None of the planes ever reached our location. For over seventeen (17) hours we received no assistance from US forces in the Mediterranean.

This is the only US Navy ship attacked by a foreign nation, involving a large loss of life and so many personnel injured that has never been accorded a full Congressional hearing.

About a year after the attack, USS LIBERTY was dismantled and scrapped.

The ship was awarded the Combat Action ribbon, and the Presidential Unit Citation, and many crew members received individual combat awards (Navy Cross, two (2) posthumously, Silver Star, Bronze Star, etc.).

I was the Commanding Officer, USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5) at the time of the attack, and was presented the Medal of Honor, by the Secretary of the Navy, at the Navy Yard on June 11, 1968, for my performance of duty during the attack and post-attack recovery period.

4. Please DO NOT delay release of Jonathan POLLARD, until after the elections on November 3, 1998, if it is your intention to release him, with or without due consultation with US military and security experts. If you are going to release him in any case, please let the people know of your intentions and executive action before they vote in the upcoming elections.

Very respectfully,

William L. McGonagle
Captain, USN (Ret.)

http://www.ussliberty.org/mcg2prez.htm



Now I am done with you traitorous shill.  Preach your lies to yourself
Rest satisfied with doing well, and leave others to talk of you as they will.
Pythagoras (BC 582-BC 507) Greek philosopher

Offline gelignite

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People are just learning that the Court of Inquiry was falsified. The Court's own legal counsel, Captain Ward Boston, now says publicly in Navy Times and elsewhere that the court actually believed that the attack was deliberate but reported otherwise falsely because it was so ordered by Washington.

http://www.ussliberty.org/history405.htm

Funny how you keep repeating the same quotes/links over and over again.

Quote
Declaration of
Ward Boston, Jr.,Captain, JAGC, USN (Ret.)

[...]

Admiral Kidd told me, after returning from Washington, D.C. that he had been ordered to sit down with two civilians from either the White House or the Defense Department, and rewrite portions of the court`s findings.

...]

"...of the court's findings", he said. And to what effect, he did not say. Furthermore, Boston didn't say anything about anyone rewriting the transcript of Inquiry testimony, much less that it had been "falsified".

And, of course, it's all hearsay, in eny event. Boston is relating what Kidd supposedly told him.

Quote
CAPTAIN WILLIAM L. McGONAGLE:  3. Please DO NOT release Jonathan POLLARD to the Government of Israel until and unless the Government of Israel acknowledges, in writing and publicly, that the Government of Israel's armed forces (air and naval) deliberately attacked USS LIBERTY (AGTR-5) (A Technical Research Ship) on June 8, 1967.

Of course the Israelis "deliberately" attacked the ship. They originally believed it to be Egyptian in origin.

The central question in all of this is whether the Israelis deliberately attacked a ship that they knew to be American.

And, on that score, McGonagle's Inquiry testimony is clear...

http://www.ussliberty.com/nci.txt

[...

I realized that there was a possibility of the aircraft having been Israeli and the attack had been conducted in error. I wanted to hold fire to see if we could read the signal from the torpedo boat and perhaps avoid additional damage and personnel injuries.

...]

Unfortunately, the Liberty's gun mounts did open fire on the Israeli torpedo boats.


[...same, oft-repeated links and quotes snipped...]
I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)

Offline E_T

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The 1967  Naval Court of Inquiry has been impugned; it has been falsified by order of D.C.; conducted under an official cover-up.  Paragraph (10)




Findings of the Independent Commission of Inquiry into the Israeli Attack on USS Liberty, the Recall of Military Rescue Support Aircraft while the Ship was Under Attack, and the Subsequent Cover-up by the United States Government
Capitol Hill, Washington, D.C.

October 22, 2003
The Moorer Commission

Admiral Thomas H. Moorer, United States Navy, (Ret.)
Former Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff

General Raymond G. Davis, United States Marine Corps, (MOH)*
Former Assistant Commandant of The Marine Corps

Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, United States Navy, (Ret.)
Former Judge Advocate General Of The Navy

Ambassador James Akins, (Ret.)
Former United States Ambassador to Saudi Arabia

We, the undersigned, having undertaken an independent investigation of Israel's attack on USS Liberty, including eyewitness testimony from surviving crewmembers, a review of naval and other official records, an examination of official statements by the Israeli and American governments, a study of the conclusions of all previous official inquiries, and a consideration of important new evidence and recent statements from individuals having direct knowledge of the attack or the cover up, hereby find the following: **

1. That on June 8, 1967, after eight hours of aerial surveillance, Israel launched a two-hour air and naval attack against USS Liberty, the world's most sophisticated intelligence ship, inflicting 34 dead and 173 wounded American servicemen (a casualty rate of seventy percent, in a crew of 294);

2. That the Israeli air attack lasted approximately 25 minutes, during which time unmarked Israeli aircraft dropped napalm canisters on USS Liberty's bridge, and fired 30mm cannons and rockets into our ship, causing 821 holes, more than 100 of which were rocket-size; survivors estimate 30 or more sorties were flown over the ship by a minimum of 12 attacking Israeli planes which were jamming all five American emergency radio channels;

3. That the torpedo boat attack involved not only the firing of torpedoes, but the machine-gunning of Liberty's firefighters and stretcher-bearers as they struggled to save their ship and crew; the Israeli torpedo boats later returned to machine-gun at close range three of the Liberty's life rafts that had been lowered into the water by survivors to rescue the most seriously wounded;

4. That there is compelling evidence that Israel's attack was a deliberate attempt to destroy an American ship and kill her entire crew; evidence of such intent is supported by statements from Secretary of State Dean Rusk, Undersecretary of State George Ball, former CIA director Richard Helms, former NSA directors Lieutenant General William Odom, USA (Ret.), Admiral Bobby Ray Inman, USN (Ret.), and Marshal Carter; former NSA deputy directors Oliver Kirby and Major General John Morrison, USAF (Ret.); and former Ambassador Dwight Porter, U.S. Ambassador to Lebanon in 1967;

5. That in attacking USS Liberty, Israel committed acts of murder against American servicemen and an act of war against the United States;

6. That fearing conflict with Israel, the White House deliberately prevented the U.S. Navy from coming to the defense of USS Liberty by recalling Sixth Fleet military rescue support while the ship was under attack; evidence of the recall of rescue aircraft is supported by statements of Captain Joe Tully, Commanding Officer of the aircraft carrier USS Saratoga, and Rear Admiral Lawrence Geis, the Sixth Fleet carrier division commander, at the time of the attack; never before in American naval history has a rescue mission been cancelled when an American ship was under attack;

7. That although Liberty was saved from almost certain destruction through the heroic efforts of the ship's Captain, William L. McGonagle (MOH), and his brave crew, surviving crewmembers were later threatened with "court-martial, imprisonment or worse" if they exposed the truth; and were abandoned by their own government;

8. That due to the influence of Israel's powerful supporters in the United States, the White House deliberately covered up the facts of this attack from the American people;

9. That due to continuing pressure by the pro-Israel lobby in the United States, this attack remains the only serious naval incident that has never been thoroughly investigated by Congress; to this day, no surviving crewmember has been permitted to officially and publicly testify about the attack;

10. That there has been an official cover-up without precedent in American naval history; the existence of such a cover-up is now supported by statements of Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, USN (Ret.), former Judge Advocate General of the Navy; and Captain Ward Boston, USN, (Ret.), the chief counsel to the Navy's 1967 Court of Inquiry of Liberty attack;

11. That the truth about Israel's attack and subsequent White House cover-up continues to be officially concealed from the American people to the present day and is a national disgrace;

12. That a danger to our national security exists whenever our elected officials are willing to subordinate American interests to those of any foreign nation, and specifically are unwilling to challenge Israel's interests when they conflict with American interests; this policy, evidenced by the failure to defend USS Liberty and the subsequent official cover-up of the Israeli attack, endangers the safety of Americans and the security of the United States.

WHEREUPON, we, the undersigned, in order to fulfill our duty to the brave crew of USS Liberty and to all Americans who are asked to serve in our Armed Forces, hereby call upon the Department of the Navy, the Congress of the United States and the American people to immediately take the following actions:

FIRST: That a new Court of Inquiry be convened by the Department of the Navy, operating with Congressional oversight, to take public testimony from surviving crewmembers; and to thoroughly investigate the circumstances of the attack on the USS Liberty, with full cooperation from the National Security Agency, the Central Intelligence Agency and the military intelligence services, and to determine Israel's possible motive in launching said attack on a U.S. naval vessel;

SECOND: That every appropriate committee of the Congress of the United States investigate the actions of the White House and Defense Department that prevented the rescue of the USS Liberty, thereafter threatened her surviving officers and men if they exposed the truth, and covered up the true circumstances of the attack from the American people; and

THIRD: That the eighth day of June of every year be proclaimed to be hereafter known as USS LIBERTY REMEMBRANCE DAY, in order to commemorate USS Liberty's heroic crew; and to educate the American people of the danger to our national security inherent in any passionate attachment of our elected officials for any foreign nation.

We, the undersigned, hereby affix our hands and seals, this 22nd day of October, 2003.

Thomas H. Moorer
Former Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff

General of Marines Raymond G. Davis, USMC, MOH*>

Merlin Staring
Rear Admiral Merlin Staring, USN, Ret.,
Former Judge Advocate General of the Navy

James Akins
Ambassador James Akins, Ret.,
Former United States Ambassador to Saudi Arabia

*IN MEMORIAM: General of Marines Raymond G. Davis, one of America's most decorated military heroes (including the Congressional Medal of Honor), Vice Chairman of this panel and one of the principal members of this Independent Commission of Inquiry, passed away in Conyers, Georgia, on September 3, 2003.>

** [1] Captain Ward Boston, USN, JAGC, Ret, the chief Navy attorney for the 1967 U.S. Navy Court of Inquiry into the Israeli attack, has recently come forward to repudiate the Court's conclusion that the attack was "a case of mistaken identity". Captain Boston has revealed that all available evidence, in fact, pointed in exactly the opposite direction - that it was a deliberate attack on a clearly identified American ship. In his affidavit dated October 9, 2003, Captain Boston states, "Admiral Kidd and I believed with certainty that this attack, which killed 34 American sailors and injured 173 others, was a deliberate effort to sink an American ship and murder its entire crew. I am certain that the Israeli pilots that undertook the attack, as well as their superiors who had ordered the attack, were aware that the ship was American." [See Exhibit attached]. Captain Boston stated that he has personal knowledge that Admiral Kidd found the attack to be "a case of mistaken identity" in 1967 only because he was under direct orders to do so by Defense Secretary McNamara and President Johnson.

[2] Lieutenant Commander David E. Lewis, USS Liberty's chief intelligence officer (who was severely wounded in the attack) has reported a conversation with Admiral Lawrence R. Geis, the Sixth Fleet carrier division commander, who visited Lewis after he had been medically evacuated by helicopter to the aircraft carrier USS America. According to Lewis, "He (Admiral Geis) said that he wanted somebody to know that we weren't forgotten" attempts HAD been made to come to our assistance. He said that he had launched a flight of aircraft to come to our assistance, and he had then called Washington. Secretary McNamara came on the line and ordered the recall of the aircraft, which he did. Concurrently he said that since he suspected that they were afraid that there might have been nuclear weapons on board, he reconfigured another flight of aircraft - strictly conventional weaponry - and re-launched it. After the second launch, he again called Washington to let them know what was going on. Again, Secretary McNamara ordered the aircraft recalled. Not understanding why, he requested confirmation of the order; and the next higher in command came on to confirm that "President Johnson...with the instructions that the aircraft were to be returned, that he would not have his allies embarrassed, he didn't care who was killed or what was done to the ship "words" to that effect. With that, Admiral Geis swore me to secrecy for his lifetime. I had been silent up until I found out from Admiral Moorer that Admiral Geis had passed away" [transcript from NBC's Liberty Story, aired on national television 1/27/92]. This statement by Commander Lewis has recently been corroborated by Tony Hart, a Navy communications technician stationed at the U.S. Navy Base in Morocco in June, 1967. Mr. Hart connected the telephone conversation between Secretary McNamara and Admiral Geis and stayed on the line to keep them connected. Hart has been recorded as saying that he overheard Admiral Geis refusing McNamara's order to recall the Sixth Fleet rescue aircraft while the ship was under attack. Mr. Hart reported that McNamara responded, "we are not going to war over a bunch of dead sailors."

[3] New evidence of intercepted radio communications between attacking Israeli pilots and the Israeli War Room, recorded by a U.S. Navy EC-121 spy plane, in which the Israeli pilots report seeing Liberty's American flag flying, has been collected by investigative author James Bamford - for 9 years the Washington Investigative Producer for ABC's World News Tonight with Peter Jennings (and author of Body of Secrets, which includes a chapter entitled Blood about the attack on USS Liberty). A similar radio message was intercepted by the EC-121 from the Israeli motor torpedo boats. This corroborates statements by surviving crewmembers, by Ambassador Dwight Porter, and by senior National Security Agency officials concerning NSA intercepts of Israeli pilot communications identifying the ship as American.


The USS Liberty Website:

http://www.gtr5.com/evidence/moorer.htm


The Attack


After surveilling USS Liberty for more than nine hours with almost hourly aircraft overflights and radar tracking, the air and naval forces of Israel attacked our ship in international waters without warning. USS Liberty was identified as a US naval ship by Israeli reconnaissance aircraft nine hours before the attack and continuously tracked by Israeli radar and aircraft thereafter. Sailing in international waters at less than five knots, with no offensive armament, our ship was not a military threat to anyone.

The Israeli forces attacked without warning and without attempting to contact us. Thirty four Americans were killed in the attack and another 174 were wounded.   The ship, a $40-million dollar state-of-the-art signals intelligence platform, was later declared unsalvageable and sold for scrap.

http://www.gtr5.com/
« Last Edit: June 13, 2009, 07:45:13 PM by E_T »
Rest satisfied with doing well, and leave others to talk of you as they will.
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Offline TheFetch

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Still following me around with the insults and abuse, I see.

Exactly - you are still following this community around with your obvious Jewish trolling. 

Quote
We shall have to do something about that.

My my my what an arrogant little racist piece of trolling trash.  There is absolutely NOTHING you can do.  The owners and moderators of the site - maybe.  You...maybe you can file a complaint with the ADL or the SPLC or one of your other Nazi thought crime Jewish only organizations -

But your ability to keep from me highlighting THE FACT THAT YOU ARE A TROLL is going to be pretty difficult.

Why do you PERSIST in TROLLING THESE FORUMS?

Offline WindRiverShoshoni

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #10 on: June 13, 2009, 11:30:47 PM »
Why do you PERSIST in TROLLING THESE FORUMS?

The same reason a fisherman trolls ~ fish bite.  And like with any sport fisherman, it's the bite and the fight, not the fetch and the catch, that makes it worthwhile.

No one fishes in waters where the fish don't bite, or at least not for long.



It's too dark here.

Offline TheFetch

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #11 on: June 14, 2009, 12:08:16 AM »
Why do you PERSIST in TROLLING THESE FORUMS?

The same reason a fisherman trolls ~ fish bite.  And like with any sport fisherman, it's the bite and the fight, not the fetch and the catch, that makes it worthwhile.

No one fishes in waters where the fish don't bite, or at least not for long.





I agree with you.  What I learned is that one of the way in which these elements operate is to bring information in a very organized way in the HOPES that people will counter their arguments, from which other agents are able to work at eliminating the arguments and information on the net and at the same time, create counter arguments. 

For example -

At the time that Israel attacked the United States on 9-11 and murdered some 3300 Americans, an attack far worse than Pearl Harbor for which other Jewish groups were voicing an interest in seeing so they could then launch their Pax Judaica (the New World Order), Jews supported the war on Iraq by over 66%.  Now a days, you would be hard pressed to find such numbers anywhere on the net, while a couple years later, there was an ongoing campaign to try to make it appear as if less then 35% of Jews supported a war on Iraq.

By countering the arguments of these trolls, what you may be doing is contributing to an eventual destruction of existing historical evidence.

That is how Jews have always played the game, from the eliminating of historical facts through wars and other forms of pogroms to altering and crafting history that conveniently leaves off information that would enable future generations to better come to grips with how the world came to be as it is in their day.

Judaism is perhaps one of the greatest regressing movements ever created and remains a primary enemy of the human race, imo.

Offline WindRiverShoshoni

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #12 on: June 14, 2009, 01:20:50 AM »
Judaism is perhaps one of the greatest regressing movements ever created and remains a primary enemy of the human race, imo.

I have only one qualification to what you're saying, and it is the same omission that I had to correct in my own paper, "Liberty," which I would suggest you read at http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?topic=13456.new#new ~ and that is calling it "Judaism" rather than "Talmudic judaism," "Israel" instead of "Temple Israel," and "Jews" instead of "zionists."  Someone who expects God to return the faithful of Moses to the Promised Land is not a "zionist," but a simple Jew who knows something about God's Promise to Israel.  These generalizing constructions conflate people who God favors with those He has cursed and will destroy, as the Talmudic zionists intend for people to do.

Doing that allows the reader to overlook the real Israel, the real Judaism, and the real Jews who have nothing to do with Talmudic zionism other than to be deceived by the "Synagogue of Satan," used as a cover and a mask by Satan's party among humanity, and sacrificed as scapegoats by these people with the shape of humans and the hearts of devils when they slip out the back door leaving innocent Jews holding the bag.

This permeates discussion of "the Jewish problem" ~ and it is definitely their problem, we make it ours by our own failures and heedlessness ~ and always has.  But in our time it simply cannot be allowed to prevail as the understanding of people who would again unwittingly carry out the "final solution" devised by the Talmudic zionists to eliminate those who might blow the whistle on them ~ and have in the past, as Jesus did, and still do.

It is endemic to the Talmudic zionist perpetuation of a distortion of Nazi fascism ~ which in the first place was a carbon copy of Talmudic zionism pasted over the "Aryan" branch of the human family, which has always been the primary and ultimate target of all their schemes.  This distortion omits the facts that Hitler worked with the Talmudic zionists to send able-bodied German Jews to Palestine; that German Jews supported Germany and Hitler and opposed the 1933 Talmudic zionist declaration of war against Germany; and other salient facts about the period of Nazi Germany, yielding a brand of "neo-Nazi" pseudo-religion that serves that cycle of death that eliminates Talmudic zionism's opponents among the Jews.

Yes, Jelly trolls.  Yes, he's very adept at eliciting arguments that his favorite people then study with a view to overcoming them with others.  And Yes, his very presence in this forum is an agitation we could well do without.

But lumping all "Jews" together with the Talmudic zionists of Temple Israel serves their agenda and has the potential for placing a blood guilt on innocents trying to do the right and necessary thing.

It all comes together, in its time, and it looks to me as if this is the time it does that.  I really, really do not want the American people stampeded into premature error, while the tactical and strategic advantage lies with the enemies of humanity.

You do realize, don't you, that for someone faithful to Moses to identify and denounce the crime of a false Jew to gentiles is not only "sinful" but a capital crime in itself?  One of them who does that is called a "moser" and the Haredim have murdered thousands, if not millions, of them over the centuries and are still doing it today ~ that's why Rabin was assassinated, which over half of Temple Israel openly applauded.  They're supposed to call the criminals to account themselves, not ask someone else to do it.

But the hypocrites "took over" the authority to do that, back in the days after Solomon died, and instead of arresting criminals, recruited them into their power structures.  This they can denounce openly, to warn the gentiles, and they do.  Those they denounce ~ which we hardly ever hear about, it's called "anti-semitism" from "self-hating Jews" ~ are the people you call "the Jews."  They're not "the Jews," they're the Talmudic zionists of Temple Israel and the complete opposite of a "Jew."

We definitely do not want to burn the wrong six million.  And the likelihood of them all being gathered in one place is precisely zero.  We ~ of humanity ~ need to know the enemy of humanity, and the Talmudic zionists have been nothing if not adept at concealing their identity, masking their corruptions, and confusing everyone else.

I'd really appreciate it were you to take note of this and incorporate it into your writing.

It's too dark here.

Offline gelignite

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #13 on: June 14, 2009, 09:01:57 AM »
Yes, Jelly trolls.

Horseshit.

Trolls do not defend their arguments.

I do. Very effectively. And, to date, I am the only one on this forum who is willing and able to counter the lies which get repeated about this topic and others.

And I do it very well.

I've caught E_T repeating lies. I've caught you repeating lies. I've exposed countless myths and falsehoods for what they are.

But if that's what you call trolling, then, yes, I suppose that's what I do.


And will continue to do so.

I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)

Offline gelignite

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #14 on: June 14, 2009, 09:14:47 AM »
[....stuff that E_T has posted at least 5 or 6 times now...]

Did you have any of your own thoughts that you were gonna contribute to this discussion, or is it just copy/paste of the exact same material over and over and over again?

Just wondering.


I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)

Offline clayman

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #15 on: June 14, 2009, 09:57:55 AM »
Trolls do not defend their arguments ... I do. ... And I do it very well.

*Ahem*

Trolls may defend both an argument and themselves.

Just as you do.

Offline Rudi Jan

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #16 on: June 14, 2009, 10:26:33 AM »
I do. Very effectively. And, to date, I am the only one on this forum who is willing and able to counter the lies which get repeated about this topic and others.

And I do it very well.


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Offline Sue

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #17 on: June 14, 2009, 10:36:23 AM »
Quote
Fetch: Why do you PERSIST in TROLLING THESE FORUMS?

WRS:  The same reason a fisherman trolls ~ fish bite.  And like with any sport fisherman, it's the bite and the fight, not the fetch and the catch, that makes it worthwhile.

No one fishes in waters where the fish don't bite, or at least not for long.''

Very well expressed, I like it.
"At any given moment there is an orthodoxy, a body of ideas which it is assumed all right-thinking people will accept without question. It is not exactly forbidden to state this or that or the other, but it is "not done".
...Anyone who challenges the prevailing orthodoxy finds himself silenced with.

Offline E_T

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #18 on: June 14, 2009, 11:29:49 AM »
[....stuff that E_T has posted at least 5 or 6 times now...]

Did you have any of your own thoughts that you were gonna contribute to this discussion, or is it just copy/paste of the exact same material over and over and over again?

Just wondering.



That is hypocrisy at its finest.  You mean like you do?  And then criticize the person and the manner that you are debunked.  Your mission has been to disseminate Cristol's BS and lies.

This is very simple.  I don't make wholesale statements as though they were fact such as you do.  I counter your debunked Cristol liberty incident and cut and paste from a falsified, rushed 1967 Naval Court of Inquiry which was conducted under an official cover-up.  Facts have been disclosed (which are posted earlier on this thread)... that have countered your slimy attempt of deceiving via some debunked Israel apologist bankruptcy attorney in FLA.

Quote
I've caught E_T repeating lies. I've exposed countless myths and falsehoods for what they are.

The fact is the other way around.  You have a lot of gall, but not an ounce of honesty.  How sad for you.



Edited to add...

Then when you don't copy and paste the whole text, slimy complains...

http://www.freedomportal.net/forum/index.php?topic=13369.msg117067#msg117067
« Last Edit: June 14, 2009, 12:02:03 PM by E_T »
Rest satisfied with doing well, and leave others to talk of you as they will.
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Offline gelignite

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Re: A reflection on the anniversary of the attack against the USS Liberty
« Reply #19 on: June 14, 2009, 02:32:08 PM »
Your mission has been to disseminate Cristol's BS and lies.

I have nothing whatever to do with AJ Cristol, other than that I happened to have read his book on the subject.

The fact is that the Liberty has been a pet subject of mine, even before the publication of Cristol's book.

In any case, Cristol has little to do with my ability to effectively argue the case that the attack was the result of mistaken identity. And between the US Navy Court of Inquiry and the UHF transcripts (between the attacking pilots and their controllers), anyone could dispel the countless myths that have been repeated on the subject, including several whoppers that you yourself have posted.

And such is precisely why the LVA has been desperately trying to cast doubt on the Inquiry testimony. They long ago realized that the sworn testimony of their own crewmates undermines many of their claims regarding the attack. And, of course, haters such as yourself latch onto the statement by Ward Boston, asserting that it proves the Inquiry testimony had been "falsified" (even though Boston never specifically makes such a claim). In fact, I remember there was a guy on the LVA forum who was trying like hell to show how McGonagle could not have been in full control of his mental faculties due to the amount of blood he'd lost during the attack. It was yet another in a long series of attempts to discredit sworn testimony which flatly contradicts LVA claims.

And that's precisely what the Inquiry transcript does. So Boston can say whatever he wants about how he really felt (and, by way of hearsay, how Kidd supposedly felt) about the Israelis. The fact remains that the crew of the USS Liberty did honestly testify as to what they saw and heard on that sunny afternoon in 1967. And their words are right there in the transcript, which plain for all to see. To discredit their testimony is to discredit those men, any way you care to slice it.

So go for it, E_T. Tell as many as you can about how the US Navy Inquiry had been, as you put it, "falsified". See how far that gets your cause when it is seen that your wild and unsupported assertion amounts to an accusation of perjury against a man who has been credited with saving the ship and the crew of the USS Liberty.

In any event, what I'm asserting has nothing to do with the promotion of Cristol, per se. In fact, much of my argument relies upon the sworn testimony of USS Liberty crewmembers who were on board the ship during the attack... testimony that you and your fellow travelers have been continuously attempting to discredit.

Fortunately, most Americans in the reality-based community can see through such transparent attempts and can easily discern the underlying motivation with which you proceed.

Quote
I don't make wholesale statements as though they were fact such as you do.

In fact, this is all that you do.


Hey, look. A whole post without a single link or a single word of copied/pasted text (other than from your post).

Would that you could do the same, but I'm afraid that it takes the ability to think for one's self, something which you've yet to demonstrate.
« Last Edit: June 14, 2009, 04:28:22 PM by gelignite »
I'm quite certain that you honestly believe in the purposes of your advocacy... And I am definitely opposed to banishment ~ your mere presence is a testimony to the value of this forum... Your absence would suggest that we are wasting our time here...

-WindRiverShoshoni (RIP)